topcat Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 (edited) I don,t think all these breaks are helping any. The postponed game against Celtic, Internationals and winter shutdowns. It just feels that the season is stopping and starting too much. I think we had a couple of away victories that there was not a game the following week. Also changing games to suit TV, friday nights etc. Then the latest SPFL shenigans on deciding playoffs. Crowds are generated by victories and momentum and we never seemed to get that until these last few games. By then too late for the season really Look at Hamilton and there great run early doors and what it did initially for there home attendance. Edited May 10, 2015 by topcat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
potty trained Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 I think it would have been a factor during the period when we were having a sticky spell but as the crowds were down right from the start of the season I don't think it was the main reason. For me it was mainly to do with pricing but as I said we would really need to find out from those who were not attending what their reasons were. I didn't suggest it was the main reason, I suggested it was a reason. A reason, during periods on the season. Can't believe you've just spent the last few posts disagreeing with me... Even though, you agree with me! For the record, I think finances are the biggest factor, and if the club had actually lowered the gate price by 10% it would have had a positive effect. It's a mental thing. If you are getting change out of 20 pound you are more likely to go in my opinion, than if you have to add to that 20. If you get change, your likely to spend it on a pie or bovril. But if you've just added 2 quid to your twenty to get in... Are you likely to go down and spend another 2 or 3 on a bovril or pie? Let's not kid on, folk are skint right now! Our weekly shop has gone up nearly 15 quid in the last year, folk are running tight budgets just to survive. And £22 every second week, plus travel, some folk just can't afford it. The club need to look at it 3 fold... The price to attend, the product that determines value for money, and the age groups(family circumstances) of those not attending. How long has kids go free been running, how many free kids have we won over to lead to them paying? Regardless of the numbers I think it's a success story, would just be interested to know the facts. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fawlty Towers Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 I didn't suggest it was the main reason, I suggested it was a reason. A reason, during periods on the season. Can't believe you've just spent the last few posts disagreeing with me... Even though, you agree with me! For the record, I think finances are the biggest factor, and if the club had actually lowered the gate price by 10% it would have had a positive effect. It's a mental thing. If you are getting change out of 20 pound you are more likely to go in my opinion, than if you have to add to that 20. If you get change, your likely to spend it on a pie or bovril. But if you've just added 2 quid to your twenty to get in... Are you likely to go down and spend another 2 or 3 on a bovril or pie? Let's not kid on, folk are skint right now! Our weekly shop has gone up nearly 15 quid in the last year, folk are running tight budgets just to survive. And £22 every second week, plus travel, some folk just can't afford it. The club need to look at it 3 fold... The price to attend, the product that determines value for money, and the age groups(family circumstances) of those not attending. How long has kids go free been running, how many free kids have we won over to lead to them paying? Regardless of the numbers I think it's a success story, would just be interested to know the facts. Apologies as I did pick up on what you meant incorrectly. Agree with the points you have made above and even from the practical side if prices were £20 & £15 it makes it easier/quicker for those buying tickets which improves the matchday experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindau Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 For what's on display, there is no way any top league club in Scotland should be charging more than £20. It's frankly ludicrous. Totally different circumstances, but went to the Olympic Stadium in Berlin 18 months ago, watched Hertha play Leverkusen for the equivalent of £18 and that included free travel to and from the match throughout the city. Outside the ground a beer and a roll and German sausage was around £2.50 in total. My boy pays £2.00 at Firhill for a flat Irn Bru........and they wonder why fans are staying away!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoda-jag Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 two seasons ago patg £18 last season patg £20 this season patg £22 next season patg £?? yes, there is the argument you go up a league, prices increase season after promotion, and i can understand that to a extent. tougher league so you need a bigger budget to compete, but is price rises the best means? having that promotion bounce, you can invariably get away with it first season as playing all new opponents, so fans more likely to come out for games against opposition we haven't played for a while. to increase patg and season tickets again two years in a row though was absolute folly and stupidity by the board. and it's not their first misjudgement by far when it comes to fan relations and understanding the mood of the majority. now if they had thought of, oh i don't know, let's say a regularly held meeting with fan reps groups four times a year to discuss what would be acceptable to the supporters, they could even conceivably avoid potential faux pas like this. hell, you could even say any time i see beattie and his friends it takes everything, every fibre of my being, not to put the nut on them. last post of the trainedpottyuser has wise words and observations. i would also say topcats post falls into same category. and just when will the jagsforce awaken hmmmm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roque Posted May 10, 2015 Report Share Posted May 10, 2015 They need to add value to the season ticket to encourage people to buy one. This is an important factor, for me, as someone who is guaranteed to miss a few games every year. Right now if you miss 2 games, you've basically broken even on your season ticket, and any more than 2 and you're losing out. I'm not sure what the situation is with other clubs, but that seems like really poor value, especially considering there's no cup games factored in. More in the way of promotions relating to hospitality could be something the club should look into as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Dave Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 All this value for money stuff really gets my goat. I can afford a season ticket, so every year I buy one as it costs around £240. I don't even contemplate whether it's a good deal or not. I buy it because it's my hobby and a bloody brilliant hobby at that. I don't play golf, go to a gym, gamble, or buy fancy cars etc.so my little luxury is a season ticket for The jags. I was introduced to the Jags as a child 44 years ago and love every minute of being a Jag. i really don't give a shit if I miss a couple of games a season. It's nice having my own personal seat, but I've only sat in it twice in the last 2 years when the Tic have come along. Outwith that I've gone and stood in the Northy with a chap I encouraged to come along at the beginning of the season, who is now an absolute diehard like me and will be buying his first ever season ticket for next season. I would suggest to the club that they spread the cost over 4 payments and like a couple of seasons ago put in a free or discounted hospitality day, but if we want to push on, then buy your season ticket and try and bring 1 pal along to the games. 1 pal, that's it. I don't think dropping the price of entry will have any effect on the crowds. It's down to us as the Jags family to encourage new blood along. We live in Glasgow where unfortunately the majority of football fans have been brought up by thickos. We all know them, neighbours, friends, colleagues who marvel at the thought of someone so simple that they can support the cuddly toy of scottish football. So we grit our teeth and get on with it and soak up the memories of occasionally humping the **** on the other side of the river, and winning the odd championship. I love my passion for The Jags and I love reading about my fellow Jags fans. My mate,who some of you may have met this season is from London. He just gets it. He loves watching the Jags and says that he feels part of a family. 1 season. He has missed about 3 games and is totally addicted. He postponed a visit to London yesterday so he could go to Hamilton. Up The Jags!!! 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Willjag Posted May 11, 2015 Members Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Would love to see the Club buck the trend and announce they are cutting PATG prices next season to £20. Would get great publicity and may even encourage a few extra numbers on the gates! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roque Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 All this value for money stuff really gets my goat. I can afford a season ticket, so every year I buy one as it costs around £240. You know what "gets my goat"? People who jabber on while not really contributing anything to the main issue. You have a mate that you brought along and is now a massive fan who is going to buy a season ticket: congratulations. Just because this happened to you doesn't mean that magically we can all afford a season ticket regardless of how many games we're going to make, or mates who currently don't go to the football that will suddenly turn into a diehard if brought along to Firhill a couple of times. Bolded is the key to why some people do care about value for money. Because they can't afford a season ticket, or to do all the things they'd like to do as a football fan thanks to the extortionate prices in our game. The point of this thread is to discuss what we, as fans of a club, can suggest to help to both increase the income for our club, while also making supporting Partick Thistle a more financially viable option. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindau Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 At this time of austerity and with plenty more to come with these cnuts in charge for the next 5 years, why does the club not offer short term packages as well as season tickets at the start of the season. More people may be willing to fork out, say £175 for a nine game (can be used at any time ) half season ticket or a 4 game ticket (to be used at any time) for say £75. Yeah it might have an impact on Season tickets, but it might be a more affordable way for other people to go down this line at the start of the season. Season tickets come out when people usually have forked out plenty for summer holidays and some people just cant afford the outlay. The club need to look at all options, though if Sevco or Hibs join Hearts in the top division next season I think the board will be rubbing their hands! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian_mac Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Big Dave I admire your passion and well done for converting your mate but a lot of your post does come across as quite short-sighted. If it really was as simple as you make it out to be then why are we struggling for crowds? The fact is that value for money quite obviously is a factor for a lot of people and the crowd figures suggest that we do have a problem here. For you to dismiss all that because it doesn't affect you is not really adding anything to the debate. It actually doesn't affect me either as I always buy a season ticket but I think we all need to look at the bigger picture here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MMCF Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 (edited) Regarding the "problem" with crowds the following stats may point you in a direction of thought. First three home SPFL games this season. 1 Ross County 3261 3261 2 Hamilton 3419 6839 3 Inverness 2917 9756 First three home SPFL games last season 1 Dundee Utd 7822 7822 2 Hearts 6540 14362 3 Aberdeen 6193 20555 We appear to have "lost" 10,000 in terms of crowds over just these three games. Ross County not a big support and it was a Wednesday. Hamilton not a big support (home or away) Inverness. Enough said. Thanks to our fifty or so regular viewers from the Highland capital. Furthermore only one Celtic home game so c5000 this season as opposed to 15000 the previous season. Only one visit from Aberdeen so c4000 as opposed to 11000 the previous season. Part of the issue has to be the way in which the fixtures fell this season. Edited May 11, 2015 by MMCF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 (edited) I know where Big Dave is coming from and in truth I too buy a season ticket as I can afford to. If for some unforeseen reason I couldn't get along to a lot of matches I would't be upset at having made a loss making purchase. But the key word there is "unforeseen". Regardless of how emotive the issue the Club can't build a sales structure that is even partly dependent on its purchasers buying a product that is relatively of no use and is bought out of blind loyalty. Imo the Club have come across as taking the piss with regards to ST holders. What happened to the discount vouchers? Why did they not continue with the ST surcharge that gave you a one off discounted hospitality deal (at a less fashionable fixture)? The Club should be trying to build on its season ticket holder fanbase by offering incremental deals etc with the likes of hospitality days, discount vouchers for certain sportswear, even a few free pies. Do something along these lines and they'd be in a position where they can drop the patg price or offer the walk up odd deal without jeopardising future ST sales. It's all very well Big Dave, myself and others saying we'd continue to purchase season tickets due to partly non monetary reasons (loyalty if you like, tho' I don't) but that's no base to try and grow sales. Edited May 11, 2015 by lady-isobel-barnett Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a f kincaid Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 (edited) In October 1952 a scribe in the Evening Times fired a shot across Thistle supporters' bows. "Only" 10,000 had attended the recent Raith Rovers game and he suggested that they would only have themselves to blame if the Board were forced to sell Alex Stott to make ends meet. My, how times have changed! Edited May 11, 2015 by a f kincaid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jag Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 It might pain folk to admit it, but we haven't been great to watch for long periods of the season. I'd suggest that has had an effect on attendances, too. I have to agree with this. Last season saw us play some sparkling football and pundits and opposition fans & managers were raving about us. Now people complain that we don't get spoken about and don't get the credit we deserve. Why not? Even although results didn't always go our way, I absolutely loved the way we played last season, especially early on. One year on we have tightened up at the back and been able to grind out results but I can't agree that because we have won more games this season means we have played more attractive football. Some of the stuff on show around the January/February period was soul destroying with Seaborne the main culprit of launching the ball forward at every opportunity. I also think that the standard of opposition has declined, helping us move higher up the league table. When I ask people why they don't attend games any more money rarely (if at all) gets mentioned as a reason. People blame the standard of football and match day experience a lot more. I'm not saying money isn't a factor, I'm just saying from my conversations with lapsed fans that it doesn't come up. I suppose the key phrase would be 'value for money'. St Johnstone have finished in the top 6 four seasons in a row now. Perth is an affluent area. Their attendances are poor. Why? I don't think it is due to money, I think it is because they are sh1te to watch. They make my eyes bleed. P.S.If you are talking about exorbitant pricing then look no further than our refreshment stalls. £2 for a teaspoon of instant coffee or a tea bag in a cup of hot water. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marco77 Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 I would love to attend more games but for me and the mrs it's just to expensive, It's something that the whole of scottish football needs to look at. If splitting into categories then Cat 1 £20 (Old Firm, Aberdeen etc) and Cat 2 £15 for the rest. Hugh difference between £44 for 2 tickets and £30. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian_mac Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Even introducing categories is massively unfair on fans. Imagine if we supported a bigger team and the other club hiked their prices up every time we visited. It's a shocking practice and thankfully now a lot of clubs in England are moving away from it. It's definitely not the answer for our problems anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Even introducing categories is massively unfair on fans. Imagine if we supported a bigger team and the other club hiked their prices up every time we visited. It's a shocking practice and thankfully now a lot of clubs in England are moving away from it. It's definitely not the answer for our problems anyway. I think you could turn that on it's head and reduce prices for all games except the ugly sisters. Say £20 the norm and £22 against the OF or equal to whatever they charge us. There's extra policing/stewarding and general stuff like repairs etc, so might as well make them pay for it. Even if it was as high as £25, 16 games at £20 plus 3 at £25 is still well under £21 on average. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian_mac Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Sorry LIB I'm not having that. Treat others the way you wish to be treated. It's not the responsibility of other clubs fans to pay for our repairs. Yes we all hate the OF but at the end of the day they are football fans the same as us. We all moan about the prices and views we get at Celtic Park yet we continue to think it's ok for us to bump prices whenever they visit. There's a massive contradiction there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady-isobel-barnett Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Sorry LIB I'm not having that. Treat others the way you wish to be treated. It's not the responsibility of other clubs fans to pay for our repairs. Yes we all hate the OF but at the end of the day they are football fans the same as us. We all moan about the prices and views we get at Celtic Park yet we continue to think it's ok for us to bump prices whenever they visit. There's a massive contradiction there. Many would disagree, Ian. btw I was hinting they were the cause of the repairs in the first place. Admittedly a big assumption and only going on hearsay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ian_mac Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 Them vandalising the ground is a separate issue. We should bill them for that retrospectively, not charge them in advance assuming that damage will be done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChewinGumMacaroonBaaaz Posted May 11, 2015 Report Share Posted May 11, 2015 (edited) F.T.O.F. ... charge em £35 ( sorry but you support one of the biggest teams in the universe, it don't come cheap, demand is high, market forces mate! ... anyhoo thought you were the best supporters in the world. ) and discount for jags fans who can produce 4 or five match programes or something. A discount voucher scheme or sumthin. Or, i dunno how the new electronic gates work, but could there be a PATG season ticket that registers attendance and builds up some credit? ... £5-10 to register and receive your card, if we reduce prices for the northy, 2 credits for JHS attendance, 1 credit for northy, accumulating 6-8 credits can be redeemed for OF tickets or high profile games or other discounts and incentives, cup ties, club shop, even pie stall free pies!!! etc... That asides, still say the North stand should be cheaper than the JHS, and less than 20quid. I know the main stand is used for away fans on policing and stewarding advice. However I think the club really ought to be considering what structural improvements to the stadium need to be made in order to accomodate 2000 or so away fans in the JHS and what improvements could be made to the main stand to comfortably accomodate a proper family section. A decent vision of how to use what we have and commitment to invest in a better configuration of seating arrangements would help I think. We've been making it up as we go along for too long. Remember last years debacle? Keep the north stand red and yellow, for christ's sake! E.T.A. Edited May 11, 2015 by ChewinGumMacaroonBaaaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shuggie Posted May 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2015 Do you know someone who has slipped away from Firhill? Can you contact them and ask them to give you straight and honest answers to an informal fan survey? What are you reasons for not coming along to watch the Jags? What would bring you back? Once you have these answers, then have a chat to see if there is anything else of interest to feedback to us all here. And thank them for helping us! Remember, Facts will drive strategies and tactics if we are to succeed in making a difference. Now, I have a couple of people to email,... Happy hunting everyone.. Get to it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lindau Posted May 12, 2015 Report Share Posted May 12, 2015 (edited) I know two lapsed supporters and in both circumstances it's strictly down to finances. Both used to be season ticket holders of many years! Both still have a great love of the club and do return for really important games (Morton and one even went to Tyncastle for the 4-2 game) Edited May 12, 2015 by Lindau Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaggernaut Posted May 12, 2015 Report Share Posted May 12, 2015 Unless somebody has experienced a serious change in financial circumstances it doesn't seem likely that simple financial considerations would account for some week in-week-out regulars to disappear almost completely. Why don't they go to every second or third home game, if they can't afford every one? Probably people just get out of the habit; Sky Sports, computer, having a few more pints.... many alternatives, these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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