Keeping The Faith? Calling For Change?

[Paukea]

Can someone list the 8 players missing people keep going on about

[jaggy]

I count 7 from yesterdays squad, Osman, Dumbuya, Booth, Fraser, Elliot, Bannigan, Lawless

[stuart_adam]

Missing:

 

Dumbuya (hardly been fit since last summer)

Fraser (hardly been fit since last summer)

Osman (training injury that required surgery)

Booth (out until Xmas?)

Elliot (out until March)

Lawless (got the man flu)

Bannigan (no idea)

Nisbet (no idea)

 

Realistically we are missing one right back, one left back and a CM from starting lineup.

 

 

[angry gaz]

Archie saying the injured players are out for a long time and we have to go with what we've got. Why then are we trying to play in exactly the same way then? How about trying to go through he middle more since our attacking fullbacks are injured? We play more across the pitch than up and down it .Awful to watch.I thought Erskine and Dools got totally isolated yesterday.

[Third Lanark]

Missing:

 

Dumbuya (hardly been fit since last summer)

Fraser (hardly been fit since last summer)

Osman (training injury that required surgery)

Booth (out until Xmas?)

Elliot (out until March)

Lawless (got the man flu)

Bannigan (no idea)

Nisbet (no idea)

 

Realistically we are missing one right back, one left back and a CM from starting lineup.

regarding Dumbaya and Fraser they have barely played in over 2 years there’s obviously something far more serious with their injuries and not sure they could be seen as integral parts of the squad for well over a year now

[smokiejag]

Been reading all the comments on this thread and others here and agree with almost everything written.

First of all, Archie's comments after the game are spot on. He like most of us saw the Killie game the way we did. The worrying thing is he knows the problems and hasn't found a solution! Just about the only positive is that the effort is still there. I also feel we're making Barton the fall guy, he wasn't any worse than several others out there today. Only Doolan looked good yesterday.

The future? As the two posters immediately above have said, keep the faith for the next two games.

If there is no improvement I don't think Archie will be sacked, I think he'll walk!

I'm an optimist but this is now very serious. Fingers crossed.

[stuart_adam]

We as a fan base are quickly becoming accepting of being bottom of the league. Yes the fans boo, and the fans grumble, lets face it numbers dropping off the gate every week is no surprise at the moment.

 

As other fans have mentioned this team have serious tactical issues, no fight, lack of fitness and no clue.

 

Killie who were managerless for the game were far better organised than us. We had an extreme lack of organisation, we are lacking a player like Sean Welsh or Abdul Osman in the middle of the park and it shows badly. 4-2-3-1 yesterday was yet another change in formation, even Manchester City concede when playing wing backs in a back 4, especially if nobody drops in. Barton doesn’t look like a midfielder, and him and Edwards just can’t develop that partnership that we need.

 

Further up the park we offered very little, Spittal, Erskine and Storey all extremely poor. Doolan worked but with very little to feed off he was never going to score yesterday.

 

And the poor management continues, every week I sit watching the game begging Archie to make a change because we can all see the pressure that eventually leads to an opposition goal, yesterday was no different for the second. Low and behold about 2-3 mins later after we conceed he makes the change. Too little too late.

 

Furthermore, either we have to be the unluckiest team ever or our defence needs to stop standing off, their 2nd goal yesterday was a great strike, but no different to Dorrans goal when his man stood 5 yards of him, or the Aberdeen goal, where his man stood 5 yards of him too.

 

The most worrying thing from a management point of view is he doesn’t learn from past lessons. 3 Seasons in a row we have struggled in the First Round of games. 3 seasons in a row we have conceeded goals in last 10 mins of games, sometimes even losing from a winning position. Now the trend with conceeding “spectacular strikes” is starting to become a worry, main reason because the lack of change in the other stats.

 

I like Archie, he was a fantastic player, and he has probably been our best manager in decades. I would argue Lambie only walked away each time because he knew what was coming. I cant see Archie changing things enough this season to turn around our season, if we are lucky 10th will be achievable.

 

Last but not least, the team. Yesterday they looked like a team content on passing the ball sideways to keep possession then lumping the ball up the park in the air. Have the players been told to do this or have the lost confidence? Do they know what style they are supposed to be playing? What position?

 

Every single one of them should hang their heads in shame, however they wont. Usual response from Archie, they will go in, go through the game on tape, talk about it and go from there.

 

BMMMH got it in one yesterday where he said someone needed Smashed. Although I think he was referring to it happening in the dressing room as opposed to on the pitch, time to stop the old pals act, get a reaction out of these players.

 

If it was my choice Archie would be out by Saturday, but its not and I think they’ll stick with him until Xmas. If he turns things around and keeps us up, then hes a better manager than I thought. I just dont see it recently.

[javeajag]

If we have the best squad of players in 40 years then Archie has failed to get the best out of them

I think the board like everyone else are reluctant to sack Archie but lose the next two games and they will have no choice

[Paukea]

I totally agree that we must give Archie the next two games as then he has played everyone once and we can put to bed the rediculous statement of our run of opening fixtures. Do people forget that we're with the big boys now and everyone needs to face the big boys at some stage.

 

I am perplexed at Archie saying that we play this system regularly and the players should no it..What players because the players who are suited to that system are injured or sick note so does this mean he doesn't know what formation suits his current available players.

4-2-3-1 never worked yesterday

3-5-2 never worked against Motherwell

 

What is alarming was some of the players attitudes yesterday They just chucked it and that's relegation attitude.

 

Is Archie to nice because I would be reading the riot act all week because Their desire and attitudes yesterday deserve it.

 

I am desperately fearful after our last two performances.

 

Nowhere near good enough

[marco77]

Yesterday was the 1st time I thought maybe a change would be needed but I would give him to winter break to turn it around (again). Something needs done now so we are not cut adrift.

[scotty]

Yesterday was the 1st time I thought maybe a change would be needed but I would give him to winter break to turn it around (again). Something needs done now so we are not cut adrift.

I think this is the contradiction many Jags fans are feeling. I know I am!

[Third Lanark]

Been reading all the comments on this thread and others here and agree with almost everything written.

First of all, Archie's comments after the game are spot on. He like most of us saw the Killie game the way we did. The worrying thing is he knows the problems and hasn't found a solution! Just about the only positive is that the effort is still there. I also feel we're making Barton the fall guy, he wasn't any worse than several others out there today. Only Doolan looked good yesterday.

The future? As the two posters immediately above have said, keep the faith for the next two games.

If there is no improvement I don't think Archie will be sacked, I think he'll walk!

I'm an optimist but this is now very serious. Fingers crossed.

i thought that was one of Doolans worse performances in a jags shirt but it’s all about opinions

Regarding Barton- my gripe is not with him not being a good player but that he just doesn’t look interested- as soon as he loses the ball he just gives up - I’m very probably doing him a disservice and he probably Is really hurting but I just fear at times he couldn’t give a stuff

Rightly or wrongly people are asking questions- but I think it’s only fair as I’ve repeatedly made the point questions are asked of the players - they are entirely in control of their own actions on the pitch

It’s maybe not too unfair either some of the others get asked questions- Is the performance and fitness coach not full time - why are the players looking so jaded and unfit

Edited October 15, 2017 by Third Lanark

[lady-isobel-barnett]

I am perplexed at Archie saying that we play this system regularly and the players should no it..What players because the players who are suited to that system are injured or sick note so does this mean he doesn't know what formation suits his current available players.

4-2-3-1 never worked yesterday

3-5-2 never worked against Motherwell

 

What is alarming was some of the players attitudes yesterday They just chucked it and that's relegation attitude.

 

Is Archie to nice because I would be reading the riot act all week because Their desire and attitudes yesterday deserve it.

 

On balance we probably make too much about formations/tactics. Granted both the 3-5-2 at Motherwell and the 4-2-3-1 yesterday were not working but in my mind it's more about the players not working that's the real cause for concern. Battlers will at least buy you time to change formation/tactics. I'll be kind and say our lot were playing with fear rather than lack of determination the last two matches but either way it amounts to the same thing. Prior to these two games I'd say there was enough mitigating circumstances to not be overcritical of the manager tho' I'd seen signs on occasion to indicate a collective attitude problem.

 

Changing the manager now, or in a week or two for that matter, is a judgment call I wouldn't like to make. Gut feeling tells me that having the threat of a pending dismissal will only exasperate the situation. So I'd like to think the Board will either sack Archie this month or make it clear that he'll remain manager for the entire season.

[falklandal1]

On balance we probably make too much about formations/tactics. Granted both the 3-5-2 at Motherwell and the 4-2-3-1 yesterday were not working but in my mind it's more about the players not working that's the real cause for concern. Battlers will at least buy you time to change formation/tactics. I'll be kind and say our lot were playing with fear rather than lack of determination the last two matches but either way it amounts to the same thing. Prior to these two games I'd say there was enough mitigating circumstances to not be overcritical of the manager tho' I'd seen signs on occasion to indicate a collective attitude problem.

 

Changing the manager now, or in a week or two for that matter, is a judgment call I wouldn't like to make. Gut feeling tells me that having the threat of a pending dismissal will only exasperate the situation. So I'd like to think the Board will either sack Archie this month or make it clear that he'll remain manager for the entire season.

 

Unfortuneately the board have never been great at communicating with the support.

[BowenBoys]

In terms of finance, the club have moved forward a great deal in the last few years. If you were to plot two lines on a graph from our promotion season onwards, I'm sure that on field success and financial stability would follow a similar path.

 

Now we have players on three year deals and the investment in the training facility. Perhaps, in the minds of the Board, we have gone from being 'a club in the Premier League' to 'a Premier League club'. Similar phrases but a very different mindset and different pressures. This might influence their thinking over the next few weeks.

[potty trained]

In terms of finance, the club have moved forward a great deal in the last few years. If you were to plot two lines on a graph from our promotion season onwards, I'm sure that on field success and financial stability would follow a similar path.

 

Now we have players on three year deals and the investment in the training facility. Perhaps, in the minds of the Board, we have gone from being 'a club in the Premier League' to 'a Premier League club'. Similar phrases but a very different mindset and different pressures. This might influence their thinking over the next few weeks.

 

And the person who got us there. The person who has given them the ability to be directors of a premier league club is Alan Archibald. They would do well to remember that.

[northjag]

I'm keeping the faith. Don't want us to end up like Killie and others around us who sack their managers all the time. There is no doubt that the injuries have effected us and any team with those amount of injuries in key positions would struggle. Think we have lost our identity a bit this year. In some ways we have too many new players and lost too many in the last few years. For example, I know Sean Welsh wasn't everyone's cup of tea but I think he was very underrated and did a lot of the dirty work that people didn't notice. We shouldn't have let him go, regardless of his injury record. I think it is important to have a core group of players who have been at the club for a long time and we at paying the price at the moment for our turnover of players. Archie should stay regardless of what happens this season. Just hope the board don't panic. Some of the players need to dig in to help archie.

[BowenBoys]

And the person who got us there. The person who has given them the ability to be directors of a premier league club is Alan Archibald. They would do well to remember that.

 

Yes.

 

We'll see...

[potty trained]

Yesterday was a wake up call to many. The realisation that we could be in a real dog fight to keep our Premier League status.

 

You can lay blame where you want, you can find reasons for where we are. But the fact remains, we are down to the bare bones of a squad and some might say, the bare bones in supporter numbers.

 

So the decision is yours. Mump and moan, demand change in the blind hope that things will change. Snipe about players, how you read their body language. Find a scape goat. Do what you want.

 

Or, you can stand up and support our manager and team. Because God knows that's what they need. In Alan Archibald, we have a manager we can all be proud of. Who's come from polishing the boots of previous greats, to leading our team through its darkest times, through back to back promotions, to being part of our last promotion. He started it on the pitch and stepped up and saw it through in the dugout. He's kept us in the top flight, learning everyday.

 

Make no mistake, in my third decade supporting Thistle, I've seem some dross, some charlatans pull on the Red n Yellow. As a wean, my Granda and Dad used to regale me with stories of Thistle greats. What we have standing in our dugout is as close to a Thistle legend as you'll see. And it's hete, in your lifetime.

 

For me, it's time for the Thistle support to give him and his players the support they need to get through this. From the first minute to the last.

 

It's easy to take credit and pat ourselves on the back when we were vocally supporting a winning team, as the twelfth man during our First Division win. Stand up and be counted now when times are tough and it will feel ten times better, when we pull through the other side.

 

The choice is yours.

 

 

 

[Auld Jag]

I supported the team yesterday as I have done for over 50 years.What I saw yesterday was concerning as the team imo did not show any fight,guts and I think everybody realised as soon as Kilmarnock scored it was game over. We came out in he second half and apart from a 5minute spell we did nothing.Is it asking to much for a bit of effort.Some on this forum say that Edwards runs about like a headless chicken,but at least he moves.We have to see some sort of reaction against Dundee.If not questions have to be asked and not just keep saying Archie will turn it around as he has done in the past.There is having faith and blind faith.

[milhouse]

Yesterday was a wake up call to many. The realisation that we could be in a real dog fight to keep our Premier League status.

 

You can lay blame where you want, you can find reasons for where we are. But the fact remains, we are down to the bare bones of a squad and some might say, the bare bones in supporter numbers.

 

So the decision is yours. Mump and moan, demand change in the blind hope that things will change. Snipe about players, how you read their body language. Find a scape goat. Do what you want.

 

Or, you can stand up and support our manager and team. Because God knows that's what they need. In Alan Archibald, we have a manager we can all be proud of. Who's come from polishing the boots of previous greats, to leading our team through its darkest times, through back to back promotions, to being part of our last promotion. He started it on the pitch and stepped up and saw it through in the dugout. He's kept us in the top flight, learning everyday.

 

Make no mistake, in my third decade supporting Thistle, I've seem some dross, some charlatans pull on the Red n Yellow. As a wean, my Granda and Dad used to regale me with stories of Thistle greats. What we have standing in our dugout is as close to a Thistle legend as you'll see. And it's hete, in your lifetime.

 

For me, it's time for the Thistle support to give him and his players the support they need to get through this. From the first minute to the last.

 

It's easy to take credit and pat ourselves on the back when we were vocally supporting a winning team, as the twelfth man during our First Division win. Stand up and be counted now when times are tough and it will feel ten times better, when we pull through the other side.

 

The choice is yours.

 

A sycophantic puff piece. You seem to prioritise Alan Archibald's reputation and career over the potential of PTFC to remain in the top flight.

 

The Thistle support have always been very patient with Archibald. He has previously lurched through periods of dreadful performances and results, and countless late capitulations, and the support have been benevolent. He has at most 3 further games to improve results or he should be sacked.

 

Quit the delusion - Archibald is never going to be the manager of a prestigious football club. He isn't good enough.

[milhouse]

 

 

A sycophantic puff piece. You seem to prioritise Alan Archibald's reputation and career over the potential of PTFC to remain in the top flight.

 

The Thistle support have always been very patient with Archibald. He has previously lurched through periods of dreadful performances and results, and countless late capitulations, and the support have been benevolent. The team have been in bad situations before and improved results but those 9 lives will run out. He has at most 3 further games to improve results or he should be sacked.

 

Quit the delusion - Archibald is never going to be the manager of a prestigious football club. He isn't good enough.

Edited October 15, 2017 by milhouse

[Fawlty Towers]

Yesterday was a wake up call to many. The realisation that we could be in a real dog fight to keep our Premier League status.

 

You can lay blame where you want, you can find reasons for where we are. But the fact remains, we are down to the bare bones of a squad and some might say, the bare bones in supporter numbers.

 

So the decision is yours. Mump and moan, demand change in the blind hope that things will change. Snipe about players, how you read their body language. Find a scape goat. Do what you want.

 

Or, you can stand up and support our manager and team. Because God knows that's what they need. In Alan Archibald, we have a manager we can all be proud of. Who's come from polishing the boots of previous greats, to leading our team through its darkest times, through back to back promotions, to being part of our last promotion. He started it on the pitch and stepped up and saw it through in the dugout. He's kept us in the top flight, learning everyday.

 

Make no mistake, in my third decade supporting Thistle, I've seem some dross, some charlatans pull on the Red n Yellow. As a wean, my Granda and Dad used to regale me with stories of Thistle greats. What we have standing in our dugout is as close to a Thistle legend as you'll see. And it's hete, in your lifetime.

 

For me, it's time for the Thistle support to give him and his players the support they need to get through this. From the first minute to the last.

 

It's easy to take credit and pat ourselves on the back when we were vocally supporting a winning team, as the twelfth man during our First Division win. Stand up and be counted now when times are tough and it will feel ten times better, when we pull through the other side.

 

The choice is yours.

 

We don't always agree PT but I am with you on this one!

[lady-isobel-barnett]

If I was in hospitality party to naming the MotM and had to name a player I'd have gone for McCarthy. He did very little of note but but still more than anyone else. Failing that I agree with the choice of Edwards. Poor game with many a mistake but at least he kinda ran around a bit and even had the temerity to take the ball forward on an occasion.

 

btw if I had been in hospitality I'd no doubt have been chucked out after tipping my soup over these Killie eejits

[sandy]

PT says it like it is. Let’s not be one of those clubs that chops & changes management teams just because we go through a barren spell.