New Management

[Auld Jag]

4 hours ago, Pinhead said:

2 days on and nobody is any the wiser....why do I get the feeling we will be dragging our heels and pull together a last minute team and struggle next season...

We will get smoke from the Firhill lum when a decision is made.

[javeajag]

I’m oretty sure a decision will be made this week 

[Winter of '63]

I got a bit riled by the "Archie Out" Parrots who were on here every time we lost a game...or even when we lost a goal. The most vociferous and repetitive seldom seemed to  go to games and their suggestions for replacements were pretty ludicrous. Sacking a manager is not a guarantee of a improved fortunes - I think the statistics show it usually doesn't make much difference. Ross County sacked two managers and went down, Hamilton held on to Canning and survived. West Brom, Stoke & Swansea all sacked their managers and were relegated. My view was that Archie deserved the full season - sadly he failed.

I was however a regular critic of many of the obvious flaws in the Team  which were clearly down to management failings.  They have been raised on here over and over again.  I would add that on Sunday,  Cerny for the first time had been told to release the ball quickly to our back four whereas for the rest of the season he waited until all 20 outfield congregated in a small area of the pitch before punting the ball upfield for us to lose possession. However, building from the back only works if you have quick full backs or wingers who can commit defenders rather than whole-hearted but limited players like McGinn & Elliot.

There is no reasonable argument in the harsh world of professional sport to keep Archie on after his failings this season. In any event, whoever takes over is likely to face a very tough task. I suspect that almost all the current squad will not be at Firhill - Cerny, Erskine, Doolan and a fit Bannigan deserve to be playing in the top league but if they are here with McCarthy & Penrice (and maybe Spittal) we have the basis of a team which might actually challenge for promotion. However, the thought of watching  Storey, Edwards and Elliot again is not inspiring and I'm not sure that it will be easy to recruit players who are actually better than Devine, Woods & Sammon far less of the quality of Osman, Dumbuya or Barton (before this season.)

Of the suggested candidates, Jim Goodwin has  done quite well at Alloa and comes over as a determined and focused guy.  I actually warmed to him a bit when I heard him as co-.commentator when we played Airdrie in the League Cup at the beginning of last season - he knew a huge amount about every one of our players.  I'm not very enthused about any of the other candidates but who knows. Giving Archie the chance to put things right is not the worst option.

I am still coming to terms with how avoidable relegation was, even considering how poor we were. I think surviving this season was far easier than getting promoted next year will be.

[macaroon]

Fair enough but what industry can afford to ignore it's customer base.   In some countries the workers do elect the management or at least have a strong representation on the mgt board,  Germany for example seems to do reasonably  well economically. 

[Jimmy McD]

41 minutes ago, Auld Jag said:

We will get smoke from the Firhill lum when a decision is made.

I think you should give an explanation A.J.  for some of our younger viewers......

[jlsarmy]

Read all the posters , can't really believe supporters are backing Archibald, it was an absolutely dreadful season and are the Club really going to reward the manager for failure who incidentally had probably the biggest budget any PTFC manager has ever had by asking him to stay on.

The support is obviously split as regards Alan Archibald because of the previous years and his playing career, I happen to think as the league got stronger with Sevco , Hearts and Hibs coming back into the league the management team were found wanting in terms of tactics , style of play and player recruitment .

The impact on the Club after relegation is huge , just look at Dundee Utd's accounts after relegation . The Board should have changed the manager in January to at least have given us a chance of staying up and that would have given the new manager the Jan transfer window to add to the squad 

If supporters think we're going back up in a season with all the cuts etc , they are being totally unrealistic, building a new team will take a lot of time hopefully with a mix of experience ( Doolan , Erskine ) and young players who we can give a pathway to first team football and with the right coach make them better players , if we don't try and do it this way we should forget about the Academy as there is really no point and the money the Weirs and the Club are spending should be allocated elsewhere .

After the last 5 years and Archibalds track record with young players coming through Lindsay and McCarthy exempted are we really going to put our trust in him to deliver this ?

 

[BowenBoys]

16 minutes ago, Winter of '63 said:

...

I am still coming to terms with how avoidable relegation was, even considering how poor we were. I think surviving this season was far easier than getting promoted next year will be.

Spot on. It's the fact that we basically sleepwalked into this position that saddens me most.

I find it frustrating that we are in limbo at the moment. I assume the Board want to keep Archibald and we are waiting for him to decide what he wants to do. Nothing else can, reasonably, explain the delay. It would be alarming if the Board really haven't yet decided on a course of action.

[allyo]

Not sure that I'd expect an announcement if Alan Archibald is staying. Am I wrong? 

[Big Col]

I think the board needs to say something about the managerial position and before the season ticket renewal letters are issued. With the support so split, it would be madness for them not to say anything.

[AndyMac]

13 hours ago, Duke Gekantawa said:

If we do replace Archie, I would rather take a punt at an upcoming manager than someone like McCall.  McCall’s last season at this level ended in a dismal relegation, remember. I’m not sure of the relevance of Goodwin’s playing ability, mind. And much of what you said about Goodwin also applies to Archie as a player.

Bear with me. I shall try to explain my thoughts more clearly.

When I was a boy I used to watch a very ropey Chelsea team play in the late 1970's. Anyway, they used to have this player called Ron "Chopper" Harris, basically he was like a human scythe, mowing down all before him. Years later I saw footage of the great Chelsea team of the late 1960's early 1970's, and you know what? Ron Harris in his pomp was actually a top class player. The point being is that he will always be remembered as "Chopper" Harris. Sometimes the labels and reputations people get are not entirely fair or warranted.

The relevance to Jim Goodwin is that many people just see him as a thug, however, in his hey day Jim could play a bit. Ok; Goodwin's a not a "big" name, but no one could ever question his commitment. Let's be honest, how many journey men pros have we all seen picking up good wages and plodding about the place? I couldn't imagine Goodwin tolerating that sort of stuff. Could you?

Jim Goodwin is an outsider, just like Thistle, the establishment hate him. He would be perfect, the place would be rocking, powder puff? It would be more like a powder keg! What's not to like?

[Keiththejag]

The bunnet wuda struggld 2 get beat off a shite livi. Clear aw his twat singnings rite after him. Send them aw to bhe un

 Fkn disgrace if they stsy on its lge 1

Am ragin th lot a them. Sllineless shitebags

 

Edited May 22, 2018 by Keiththejag

[allyo]

I'm not sure bhe un would have them

[Keiththejag]

13 minutes ago, allyo said:

I'm not sure bhe un would have them

Missd the s. But fkn hite aw eason

 

[DenisOhDenis]

I like Archie.  I have always liked Archie.  I liked him as a player.  I liked him as manager.   I still like Archie but it's time to go.  

[kevin energy]

Is it telling its 2 days now and still nothing 

[Auld Jag]

6 hours ago, Jimmy McD said:

I think you should give an explanation A.J.  for some of our younger viewers......

In the good old days when people wanted to heat their house up they burned an item called coal for heat.To get rid of the smoke that was caused by burning the coal houses had things called chimneys or as some called them lums. Any way when Thistle were behind at Firhill the houses close by lums would emit smoke and make it extremely foggy and the game would need to be cancelled.Just like the fog machine we used at Cowdenbeath in 2013.

[Auld Jag]

7 hours ago, allyo said:

Not sure that I'd expect an announcement if Alan Archibald is staying. Am I wrong? 

I would hope that we would get told if Archibald is staying or going within the next day or 2.Even if he is staying I would expect an announcement.Also on another point, some fans on this forum continued to defend Archibald all season and said he would keep us up. Since Sunday I don't recall seeing any of them giving their view if they think he should still be in charge next season. I would be interested to know what they think now.

[Paolo]

8 hours ago, javeajag said:

To be honest if we sacked our manager every year and were successful I’d be happy !

I agree,.  A lot of people saying a 5 year plan,.  Any manager should be told what we expect,  promotion in your first season or youre out

[Paolo]

6 hours ago, fenski said:

Tend to find that managers that are appointed in a panicked knee-jerk manner end up getting the bullet not too long after. Getting the right person takes time.

So unless the board have been on the case behind the scenes, I think the options are very limited. Maybe not the most positive way of looking at it, but that's where we are in my opinion.

Would like to think the board are already on the case,. Pre season training starts again in a few weeks,. We need to get planning on the assault on this league soon

[Dick Dastardly]

5 hours ago, Paolo said:

Would like to think the board are already on the case,. Pre season training starts again in a few weeks,. We need to get planning on the assault on this league soon

Will all our players be back from the World Cup by then ?

[Lenziejag]

11 hours ago, laukat said:

Ferguson did at Manchester United pretty much what he did at Aberdeen in that he took about 3 years to change the team into what he wanted to be (i'm told he did the same at St Mirren but I was too young to remember that). The thing that made Ferguson a true managerial great is that he had an ability to constantly rebuild teams and could spot talent in players no matter their age. Some managers are good at bringing through youth and some at making more experienced players give that extra bit more but he could do it across generations.

The big surprise was that Manchester United board were clued up enough to realise he could do it if and that they gave him the time to do it he would. Ferguson already had the skills he just took it to a bigger stage.

Actually finding a manager that changed their style after 5 years and gained success is rare. There is probably such a person out there but I can't think of one

All probably true but you have neglected the most relevant part of his Man U history. If they hadn’t beaten Crystal Palace in the Cup final replay none of the success would have happened for Man U.

[eljaggo]

The strong possibility of relegation has been apparent for 5 or 6 months.  The  team's failings have been evident, consistent and persistent, and it is hard to believe that the Board have not already discussed these with Alan Archibald.  I therefore don't subscribe to the view that a discussion now between the Board and it's manager will reveal anything that is not already understood, and would therefore provide the basis for noticeable future improvement under Alan Archibald. 

I think that Alan Archibald has been a lucky manager in inheriting a good squad, but he has not been able to either build on that squad nor even replenish it as players have been injured or have left.  He undoubtedly has benefitted recently from his status as an iconic ex-player, no matter how much credit you give him for the last 4 or 5 years. 

The players that some here see as the core for a quick promotion are almost all past their prime, and there is the risk that under Alan Archibald next year they form the basis of the team with players brought in to support them.  That would risk repeating the mistakes of this season.

A new manager with new ideas is needed.  Now.

Edited May 23, 2018 by eljaggo

[Gary Peebles Tackle]

After the defeat on Sunday I have to admit I felt it was time for a change of management, however having had a few days for it all to sink in, I’m not so sure.

Yes, they’ve made mistakes. Of course they have. However, they will rightly be feeling short changed by the players. Start of the season I, like many others, thought this was the best squad I’d ever seen at Firhill. 

Injuries rocked us big time, we had to change the XI nearly every week. This doesn’t help & the faces we eventually brought in were essentially emergency cover. 

Anyway, I firmly believe there is nobody better available & we should announce today that Archie is staying - that way the rebuild can start now - it needs to. 

[Hankey]

Archie is unsackable and can do as he likes. The majority of the fanbase have made that abundantly clear. 

[Jag]

15 hours ago, Winter of '63 said:

I am still coming to terms with how avoidable relegation was, even considering how poor we were. I think surviving this season was far easier than getting promoted next year will be.

I tried to explain to my son a few weeks ago that relegation wouldn't be all bad. I had kind of convinced myself too that it wouldn't be the end of the world and if it happened I wouldn't let it bother me too much.

However, this is exactly what I am finding difficult to deal with. We had so many chances to get ourselves out of it and we couldn't do it. Regardless of how poor a season we had, we had chances, right up until the final day and we blew it. It was avoidable as you say and would have been a lot easier than finding our way back.