Morton vs. Thistle

[Third Lanark]

31 minutes ago, laukat said:

If thats true Caldwell should be sacked.  We lost 2 goals in the first half so how does he explain the 3 in the second half? If he doesn't see the problem with the first 2 goals was their leftback skinning Christie and picking his spot he needs a serious look at himself.

He basically threw any chance of getting back into the game by subbing McGinty and choosing to play Keown, Elliot and McCarthy out of positon. Beyond that he's also thrown McCarthy and Elliot under the bus.

Archie should have went after the 4-0 loss at county because he got his selection and tactics totally wrong. Caldwell got his selection, tactics, formation, substitutes and has now scapegoated the wrong player in a post match interview. He needs to go that was unacceptable

Mcginty has been useless as well should never have been signed. I cannot think of any reason for him to give Elliott a new deal 

[David Brent]

I would just like to state that I actively and viciously dislike Cammy Bell.

[Third Lanark]

34 minutes ago, Hankey said:

I really do blame the fans. Low self esteem as ****. Defended Archie until the bitter end. Even after Livi it was " but who else could do the job?". Congratulating the club all over social media for sticking with Archie. Ridiculed fans who wanted a change. No other clubs fans of a similar stature would have put up with this shit for so long. We get what we deserve. 

Out of likes but post of the day - some fans I get the impression still think Archie should have been kept 

[Norgethistle]

37 minutes ago, Hankey said:

I really do blame the fans. Low self esteem as ****. Defended Archie until the bitter end. Even after Livi it was " but who else could do the job?". Congratulating the club all over social media for sticking with Archie. Ridiculed fans who wanted a change. No other clubs fans of a similar stature would have put up with this shit for so long. We get what we deserve. 

^^^This ^^^

[Auld Jag]

37 minutes ago, Hankey said:

I really do blame the fans. Low self esteem as ****. Defended Archie until the bitter end. Even after Livi it was " but who else could do the job?". Congratulating the club all over social media for sticking with Archie. Ridiculed fans who wanted a change. No other clubs fans of a similar stature would have put up with this shit for so long. We get what we deserve. 

Agree. Also some of them that defended Archie no longer seem to post.

[Guest]

Just now, Auld Jag said:

Wasn't at game today,so cant comment on the performance. We are talking about releasing players in January on this forum, if they have contracts until the end of this season we need some other team to take them or we are stuck with them.

AJ, do you not think we can afford to get players into the club in january and simply drop this dross?

I know they have contracts to the end of the season so we are stuck with them but they at least need dropped. They can train together. Do their own thing. If we stick with what we have just cos we are paying them a wage then we are doomed to Div1. 

I won't be going to another away game until they pick up. I'm done with it. If it gets any worse home games will be in doubt too. The game to game support is voting with their feet.

And just as i give up all hope the new gaffer seems to be saying the right things on jagzone..............i'm off for a lie down after i've dried out. I don't think i've ever been to greenock and not seen the rain

 

[stuart_adam]

The biggest thing that got me was “Back to training on Monday” after that absolute disaster I’d be bringing them in for running tomorrow!!! Certainly need to earn their wage somehow as they didn’t do it today!

[Norgethistle]

40 minutes ago, laukat said:

If thats true Caldwell should be sacked.  We lost 2 goals in the first half so how does he explain the 3 in the second half? If he doesn't see the problem with the first 2 goals was their leftback skinning Christie and picking his spot he needs a serious look at himself.

He basically threw any chance of getting back into the game by subbing McGinty and choosing to play Keown, Elliot and McCarthy out of positon. Beyond that he's also thrown McCarthy and Elliot under the bus.

Archie should have went after the 4-0 loss at county because he got his selection and tactics totally wrong. Caldwell got his selection, tactics, formation, substitutes and has now scapegoated the wrong player in a post match interview. He needs to go that was unacceptable

How should he be sacked?  Archie got his tactics, selections and subs wrong consistently for nearly 18 months yet folk still wanted him kept.

 

McGinty wasn’t just hooked for the goals he flung his toys out the pram in the dressing room when his performance was questioned and was hooked for that

[gianlucatoni]

1 hour ago, Thistleberight said:

All fair enough. Wish neither he nor scott any badness. A sorry would have been nice. They started this mess........after a great run of success it has to be said and a huge thanks for all the fun times but this isvl the here and now. They fu#ked up big time. 

The real world and workplace is littered with management incompetence dressed up as a strategic 'vision' - senior level managers who truly believe in their own idea at the expense of everyone else - and when it goes well and truly t*ts up they walk away with a big golden goodbye payment, move into consultancy to convince other unsuspecting incompetents who lack a vision and wish to follow, and leave the workers behind to pick up the pieces & take the blame for the shi*tstorm that follows.

I've come across a good few characters like this in my working life and not a single one has said sorry.

 

[Metz]

43 minutes ago, Hankey said:

I really do blame the fans. Low self esteem as ****. Defended Archie until the bitter end. Even after Livi it was " but who else could do the job?". Congratulating the club all over social media for sticking with Archie. Ridiculed fans who wanted a change. No other clubs fans of a similar stature would have put up with this shit for so long. We get what we deserve. 

After today you really are having a laugh. If change us what you craved how are you enjoying tonight? Then again maybe not hurting much as you never had to watch the outcome of those crap and ridiculous halftime decisions. 

[Auld Jag]

Just now, Thistleberight said:

AJ, do you not think we can afford to get players into the club in january and simply drop this dross?

I know they have contracts to the end of the season so we are stuck with them but they at least need dropped. They can train together. Do their own thing. If we stick with what we have just cos we are paying them a wage then we are doomed to Div1. 

I won't be going to another away game until they pick up. I'm done with it. If it gets any worse home games will be in doubt too. The game to game support is voting with their feet.

And just as i give up all hope the new gaffer seems to be saying the right things on jagzone..............i'm off for a lie down after i've dried out. I don't think i've ever been to greenock and not seen the rain

 

Not sure if we could afford to drop about half a team and get other players in.It has been said Caldwell done his research on the team before he got the job, so I take it he knew what he was being expected to work with. So far he has not changed anything. We still have 7 games to play before January, we need to start picking up points before then. Caldwell seems to talk a good game, but so far he has not delivered.

[Z88]

30 minutes ago, Third Lanark said:

In that case Falkirk will be in the same boat

Fingers crossed!

[laukat]

Just now, Norgethistle said:

How should he be sacked?  Archie got his tactics, selections and subs wrong consistently for nearly 18 months yet folk still wanted him kept.

 

McGinty wasn’t just hooked for the goals he flung his toys out the pram in the dressing room when his performance was questioned and was hooked for that

The manager selected a team and formation that put pressure on our weakness. i.e. totally exposed Elliot are right back.

By the looks of it at halftime rather than say to the players he made a mistake and wants to change formation to either 3-5-2 or 4-4-2 to give Elliot some protection he's had a pop at McGinty. If you're in McGinty's how would you react?

That however wasn't the worst part. Having decided to take off McGinty he looks to his subs bench and ignores the experienced left sided defender. (If you're Scobbie how do you feel about that?) He then throws McCarthy at right back who's never played there (How does that help McCarthy or the team ?) throws Elliot into central defense who's never played there and who is having a terrible game (How does that help Elliot or the team?) Also puts Keown into left centre defense who is not on the top of his game right now (how does that help Keown and the team?)

That wasn't just a poor day at the office from the manager. In one day he's probably lost most of the dressing room and you might say no loss there but these are the guys we will have like it or not for most of the season. It starts with his poor selection but goes off the rails because he couldn't manage the situation at halftime. Thats incomptence and that in my mind is a sackable level of incompetence.

 

 

[Norgethistle]

3 minutes ago, laukat said:

The manager selected a team and formation that put pressure on our weakness. i.e. totally exposed Elliot are right back.

By the looks of it at halftime rather than say to the players he made a mistake and wants to change formation to either 3-5-2 or 4-4-2 to give Elliot some protection he's had a pop at McGinty. If you're in McGinty's how would you react?

That however wasn't the worst part. Having decided to take off McGinty he looks to his subs bench and ignores the experienced left sided defender. (If you're Scobbie how do you feel about that?) He then throws McCarthy at right back who's never played there (How does that help McCarthy or the team ?) throws Elliot into central defense who's never played there and who is having a terrible game (How does that help Elliot or the team?) Also puts Keown into left centre defense who is not on the top of his game right now (how does that help Keown and the team?)

That wasn't just a poor day at the office from the manager. In one day he's probably lost most of the dressing room and you might say no loss there but these are the guys we will have like it or not for most of the season. It starts with his poor selection but goes off the rails because he couldn't manage the situation at halftime. Thats incomptence and that in my mind is a sackable level of incompetence.

 

 

We only have 1 right back, Elliot and he’s not a natural RB. We started the season knowing Elliot was suspended yet still failed to sign a back up. That’s Archie’s fault not Caldwell’s.

[Paukea]

Who does the Jagzone interviews because you my friend are an absolute walloper 

[Third Lanark]

7 minutes ago, laukat said:

The manager selected a team and formation that put pressure on our weakness. i.e. totally exposed Elliot are right back.

By the looks of it at halftime rather than say to the players he made a mistake and wants to change formation to either 3-5-2 or 4-4-2 to give Elliot some protection he's had a pop at McGinty. If you're in McGinty's how would you react?

That however wasn't the worst part. Having decided to take off McGinty he looks to his subs bench and ignores the experienced left sided defender. (If you're Scobbie how do you feel about that?) He then throws McCarthy at right back who's never played there (How does that help McCarthy or the team ?) throws Elliot into central defense who's never played there and who is having a terrible game (How does that help Elliot or the team?) Also puts Keown into left centre defense who is not on the top of his game right now (how does that help Keown and the team?)

That wasn't just a poor day at the office from the manager. In one day he's probably lost most of the dressing room and you might say no loss there but these are the guys we will have like it or not for most of the season. It starts with his poor selection but goes off the rails because he couldn't manage the situation at halftime. Thats incomptence and that in my mind is a sackable level of incompetence.

 

 

So you would sack Caldwell after 3 very poor games? Are you happy to keep Elliott and mcginty who have been quite frankly nothing better than awful this season?

if he has lost the dressing room means he can play the younger players eg sneddon instead of bell, kermoe and Fitzpatrick instead of quite frankly take your pick.

At least the fans would have more patience. archie a lost the dressing room but were you not one of the fans asking for him to be given till the end of the season?

[laukat]

3 minutes ago, Norgethistle said:

We only have 1 right back, Elliot and he’s not a natural RB. We started the season knowing Elliot was suspended yet still failed to sign a back up. That’s Archie’s fault not Caldwell’s.

Did Caldwell know this when he took the job?

If not why not when he's meant to have done indepth research?

If he did why did he not either insist on signing an unsigned player or change formation and personnel to compensate for that weakness?

Its not on to walk into a struggling team and express surpprise that the playing squad isn't very good. His job was to make them better not worse.

When Lambie first came in he inherited an absolute shower of sh*te from Billy Lamont and then later from Dick Campbell. Did he moan that he hadn't been left a team of winners or did he do something to make that team better?

[Norgethistle]

6 minutes ago, laukat said:

Did Caldwell know this when he took the job?

If not why not when he's meant to have done indepth research?

If he did why did he not either insist on signing an unsigned player or change formation and personnel to compensate for that weakness?

Its not on to walk into a struggling team and express surpprise that the playing squad isn't very good. His job was to make them better not worse.

When Lambie first came in he inherited an absolute shower of sh*te from Billy Lamont and then later from Dick Campbell. Did he moan that he hadn't been left a team of winners or did he do something to make that team better?

You defended Archie for month after month, yet Caldwell you want fired after 3 games, your not another one of his relatives that post on here are you?

[Third Lanark]

7 minutes ago, laukat said:

Did Caldwell know this when he took the job?

If not why not when he's meant to have done indepth research?

If he did why did he not either insist on signing an unsigned player or change formation and personnel to compensate for that weakness?

Its not on to walk into a struggling team and express surpprise that the playing squad isn't very good. His job was to make them better not worse.

When Lambie first came in he inherited an absolute shower of sh*te from Billy Lamont and then later from Dick Campbell. Did he moan that he hadn't been left a team of winners or did he do something to make that team better?

Did Caldwell pinch a girlfriend of yours? You had no problem with 18 months of insipid performances and duds being signed- yet you want a guy sacked after 3 games.

he was quite possibly the wrong appointment but you seem to have a hate for him that goes way beyond the average fans dislike of a new manager after 3 games, probably even more excessive than red monkeys dislike of the appointment of dick Campbell 

[jaf]

1 hour ago, laukat said:

Totally correct. I sat and watched even after the County game when I knew that Archie had to go.

I won't be making the same mistake again so I'm voting with my feet. Haven't felt this way about Thistle since Dick Campbell was in charge. I love going to Thistle game's but the level of incompetence on display makes it impossible to enjoy. I won't be back with Caldwell in charge.

I nearly always agree with your posts. You always seem to capture what I have been saying or thinking. 

I understand not going back whilst Caldwell is in charge. And I respect each person should make their own decision. I have not taken to him at all either. But Caldwell (and the board) will be taking this club to the brink and we need good articulate sensible supporters  on the other side.  We can’t afford to lose supporters.  

[laukat]

4 minutes ago, Norgethistle said:

You defended Archie for month after month, yet Caldwell you want fired after 3 games, your not another one of his relatives that post on here are you?

I think you've got me mixed up with someone else. Have a look back at my posts and you'll see I was very much of the opinion Archie had to go after the Livi game. I made the point that keeping Archie was reminicent of keeping Murdo and would lead to a downward spiral. Sadly it looks like thats coming to pass however even I didn't think it would happen this fast.

Not quite sure why how my relations effect the validity of my comments but just for you I'll let you into a secret - I'm not related to any Thistle manager past or present, just a fan that pays his money and getting sick of watching the cr*p thats on offer. 

[Guest]

Just now, laukat said:

The manager selected a team and formation that put pressure on our weakness. i.e. totally exposed Elliot are right back.

By the looks of it at halftime rather than say to the players he made a mistake and wants to change formation to either 3-5-2 or 4-4-2 to give Elliot some protection he's had a pop at McGinty. If you're in McGinty's how would you react?

That however wasn't the worst part. Having decided to take off McGinty he looks to his subs bench and ignores the experienced left sided defender. (If you're Scobbie how do you feel about that?) He then throws McCarthy at right back who's never played there (How does that help McCarthy or the team ?) throws Elliot into central defense who's never played there and who is having a terrible game (How does that help Elliot or the team?) Also puts Keown into left centre defense who is not on the top of his game right now (how does that help Keown and the team?)

That wasn't just a poor day at the office from the manager. In one day he's probably lost most of the dressing room and you might say no loss there but these are the guys we will have like it or not for most of the season. It starts with his poor selection but goes off the rails because he couldn't manage the situation at halftime. Thats incomptence and that in my mind is a sackable level of incompetence.

 

 

Post of the season. Unlikely to be bettered.

Lets not turn our forum into a witch hunt but there are growing tangible concerns that the board have got this horribly wrong.

Someone with zero knowledge of the game can see we need to sort out the back 4/5/3 whatever is the best system with the players we have. STOP shipping goals has to be the first job and he is failing in that simple action. It's impossible now a days to sack pretty much anyone in any field of employment and there's no way the board wil get rid this early but laukat is correct that what went on today IS a sackable offence. I'd resign out of embarrassment.

This is lamont/mccormack/johnstone/clark stuff right here. So far he's no better than what we had. We should beep like an articulated lorry we've been going backwards for so long

[Guest]

Just now, Paukea said:

Who does the Jagzone interviews because you my friend are an absolute walloper 

I ran out of likes....AGAIN

[Winter of '63]

I criticised posters last year who were making judgements on players and the manager when they weren't at the game...and I thought that Gary Caldwell was a reasonable choice as manager if only because I didn't want McIntyre or Hughes. However, I did fear he might be like Derek Whyte - a top level playing career despite never looking particularly great and a well-scrubbed but bland media persona who talked a good game but totally failed to deliver as Thistle manager.

I wasn't at Cappielow, but the early signs are worrying - I have shaken my head at each of Caldwell's three team selections and the results and performances have been awful. I  thought any manager would almost immediately have identified the obvious flaws - that Storey has started all 3 games makes me wonder.  McGinty is a mediocre player but like the rest of our back four there isn't another option. If the reports that his substitution was tactical, this looks like an appalling managerial decision...then playing the hapless Elliot at centre back seems absurd.

The apparent threats of a clear out in January are hardly conducive to building confidence and a team-spirit. The recruitment for this season was very poor and we have an unbalanced squad.  Penrice was highly regarded on loan at East Fife and Livingston but has looked uncertain, the rest of the back four needs upgrading.  I wouldn't be disappointed to see Mutombo, Storer and Storey move on. However, Bannigan, Slater, Erskine & Doolan are certainly good Championship Players, McCarthy and Fitzpatrick have looked well worth their places and Quitongo and Coulibally if fit are surely good enough at this level

I don't go along with the idea that we are somehow going to find a whole team of better quality players in January - Mark Ridgers, Danny Devine,  James Craigen, Mark Kerr & Declan McDaid are all regulars in teams higher up the League than us but I don't think they would improve our team - Ian McCall is getting the most out of his players...there is no sign that Caldwell is on the right course to get the best out of our squad despite having far superior resources.

We may of course be looking back in May on the Morton result as a low point as we celebrate the great turnaround  which brought us a spectacular promotion...but somehow I doubt it.

 

[Hankey]

48 minutes ago, Metz said:

After today you really are having a laugh. If change us what you craved how are you enjoying tonight? Then again maybe not hurting much as you never had to watch the outcome of those crap and ridiculous halftime decisions. 

We backed ourselves into a corner when we kept backing a shot fighter and then sacked him between windows with Caldwell left to pick up the shit. If the fans were loud enough at various points before this he'd have gone, but the same old shite kept ringing despite things getting worse and worse. Killie 5-1, last minute goals v Dundee/Hamilton, RC 4-0, the play offs v lower opposition. Even before the window closed when it was obvious we were miles off the so called aim of a title challenge. He could have all gone at those points but was backed again and again by fans who let him away with months of piss poor results. Archie would have been emptied by other clubs long before he was here, and that's as much down to a lot of the fanbase who were continuously supportive of his position despite the teams decline as it is the board who lacked the stones to get rid of their pals.