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Jagsman
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If I were Caldwell I would start exactly the same with Storey replacing Cardle on the left side , IMO Harkins hasn’t got the legs for 90 mins and defensive midfield I’m not sure about either, Harkins coming on when the game has opened out a bit seems a better idea when he can use his creative ability to unlock defences .

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1 hour ago, eljaggo said:

He rightly, in my opinion, won man of the match, set up the first goal, posed huge problems for their defence, and you think he should be dropped!

You need to read what I wrote. I said I don’t expect him to start not that he should be dropped.Caldwell said after the Stranraer game that he was pleased with Fitzpatrick, but that he needed to be protected.

Playing at Firhill is a different proposition to playing at Inverness.

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1 hour ago, javeajag said:

I didn’t say where the players had come from though we had 4 new players starting yesterday all of whom improved the team and factually we have improved in January with our results ....I know you don’t like it but there you go

Your quote was “ the squad he inherited was deeply flawed”.

I just pointed out that yesterday’s starters were in the main the deeply flawed squad. And go what it is worth, I have nothing against Caldwell. I really want him to succeed.

What I do have a gripe with is the belittling of Archibald’s achievements. Promotion within 6 months of taking charge. Top flight participation for 5 years and a top 6 finish. Sure his last season in the premiership really tainted his record as did the start of this season. 

If Caldwell gets close to that record, I will be very happy.

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8 minutes ago, Lenziejag said:

You need to read what I wrote. I said I don’t expect him to start not that he should be dropped.Caldwell said after the Stranraer game that he was pleased with Fitzpatrick, but that he needed to be protected.

Playing at Firhill is a different proposition to playing at Inverness.

You’ve got to play him , yesterday he was the difference, 2nd half especially. He’s won MOM last 2 games , plenty time to rest him later on in the season .

 

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5 minutes ago, jlsarmy said:

You’ve got to play him , yesterday he was the difference, 2nd half especially. He’s won MOM last 2 games , plenty time to rest him later on in the season .

 

What Caldwell has to do us manage his progression. Putting him in a situation that could damage his confidence is no good for PTFC or Fitzpatrick.

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Gary Caldwell was appointed manager when we were in no real danger of relegation. He was brought in to win us promotion and subsequently led us to bottom place.

Much as it was a good win yesterday, it was also widely classed as a "must win" and that dire situation was of Caldwell's own making. Will we keep this improved form up and continue climb the table? Or is this as good as it gets? We shall just have to wait and see.

Tell you something for nothing though, if Caldwell manages to steer us clear of relegation I wont be hanging out the bunting and hailing it as a marvelous success.

Why would anyone be full of praise for someone that's only just about managed to clear up there own mess?

Some folk are easily impressed.

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15 minutes ago, AndyMac said:

Gary Caldwell was appointed manager when we were in no real danger of relegation. He was brought in to win us promotion and subsequently led us to bottom place.

Much as it was a good win yesterday, it was also widely classed as a "must win" and that dire situation was of Caldwell's own making. Will we keep this improved form up and continue climb the table? Or is this as good as it gets? We shall just have to wait and see.

Tell you something for nothing though, if Caldwell manages to steer us clear of relegation I wont be hanging out the bunting and hailing it as a marvelous success.

Why would anyone be full of praise for someone that's only just about managed to clear up there own mess?

Some folk are easily impressed.

Ran out of likes.

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5 hours ago, jlsarmy said:

Still got a long way to go and it’ll change week by week , I enjoyed yesterday when we beat QOS just as I enjoyed beating QOS when Archie was in charge this season .  Reality is Caldwell has won 2 league games since he arrived and we’re almost in February, Archie had won 3 league games in 6 weeks before he got sacked .

Biggest change for me is Caldwell realising 3 or 5 at the back with holding midfielders wasn’t working, the last couple of weeks playing with 2 wingers Cardle and Fitzpatrick in the team has made a huge difference to the way the team play .

We still need to start winning games away from home to get out of this ( only 6 home games left )next week against Inverness is a tough game whether we were playing well or not and if we got a result up there that would definitely be significant.

 

 

51 minutes ago, laukat said:

The point is its not about what was said at the interview it was about what was relayed to the fans so as an example below in bold is a quote from Jacqui Low.

"Chairman Jacqui Low said the club were "blown away by Gary's interview preparation".

"In the space of a week, he had done an analysis of each player, identified a training schedule to deal with the fitness levels and pulled together a vision of how to get Thistle playing well enough to secure promotion," she added.

As I said before part of the problem is he was presented as being appointed to get us promotion not save us from relegation. Its not impossible we still make the play-offs but I think most of us would agree that we are in a relegation battle not a promotion campaign. The quote above  also implies he could make the current squad better and not have to wait for his own recruitment which clearly hasn't been the case.

The win yesterday buys him time to convince more of us that he is the right guy. An away win would be clear signs of improvement and hopefully thats what happens.

 

 

1 hour ago, Norgethistle said:

A manager, any manager, should be judged by his recent results and currently his results recently have been decent.  If he can get a run together and get us up the table then that will be judged as a relative success, if this is merely a blip and we go back to the atrocious form prior to Xmas then he’ll be judged as a failure 

No more likes. Agree with all of these.

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19 minutes ago, Lenziejag said:

What Caldwell has to do us manage his progression. Putting him in a situation that could damage his confidence is no good for PTFC or Fitzpatrick.

You’ve got to play him , you’re right there will be dips in confidence and form and that’s got to be managed,it’s all about learning how to be a footballer,he was the difference yesterday for me ,why wouldn’t you play him as his confidence must be sky high.

I remember James McCarthy bossing David Rowson at 16 yrs of age at Firhill , by the time he had left Hamilton at 19rs of age he had played almost 100 games.

If they’re good enough we should play them at any age , we take too long for our players to break through 21 or 22 years of age , the best players in the world didn’t start playing  1st team football at 21 or 22 years of age ( Michael Owen , Wayne Rooney etc )

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7 minutes ago, jlsarmy said:

You’ve got to play him , you’re right there will be dips in confidence and form and that’s got to be managed,it’s all about learning how to be a footballer,he was the difference yesterday for me ,why wouldn’t you play him as his confidence must be sky high.

I remember James McCarthy bossing David Rowson at 16 yrs of age at Firhill , by the time he had left Hamilton at 19rs of age he had played almost 100 games.

If they’re good enough we should play them at any age , we take too long for our players to break through 21 or 22 years of age , the best players in the world didn’t start playing  1st team football at 21 or 22 years of age ( Michael Owen , Wayne Rooney etc )

That’s fair comment. If you are good enough you are old enough. I already said why he might not be played, but your view is equally valid.

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There's been a few posters on here recently having a dig saying that anybody who has criticised Caldwell must be gutted cos he's had a few decent results.

This is stupid and these people don't understand football. Its the club that football fans support not the manager.  

If a bad manager is destroying the club he deserves criticism if he turns things around or is replaced by a good manager then that manager deserves praise.

The club hasn't turned any corners yet and remains in a precarious position. End of February will give a more realistic picture of where we are. At that point fans can make an assessment and give the manager the praise or criticism he deserves. Nobody has got it in for Caldwell. If he has got the job under false pretences he should be booted out. If he has ability and brings success the fans will love him.

Football is played in the moment and opinions on a forum have a lifespan.

 

Edited by Legs Like A Spider
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The 

2 hours ago, lady-isobel-barnett said:

Lenziejag can answer for himself but I read his post as he expects Caldwell will drop Fitzpatrick to accommodate Harkins. Don't think he was saying in his opinion Fitzpatrick should be dropped.

Had Cardle not been injured someone would have to make way for Harkins, if as I believe Caldwell sees GH as a certain starter.  I wouldn't be surprised if Caldwell reverts to the Tannadice template next Saturday. By that I mean a wide diamond with Harkins deep allowing Banzo and Slater to get further forward. Fitzpatrick could replace Storey from the Tannadice lineup.  

On the subject of Fitzpatrick a couple of fans I was talking to thought he'd picked up an injury towards the end of the game. He did take a heavy tackle but I thought after a wee while limping he was running freely again.

Fitzpatrick said after the game he was absolutely fine and it was just a bit of cramp.

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40 minutes ago, Legs Like A Spider said:

There's been a few posters on here recently having a dig saying that anybody who has criticised Caldwell must be gutted cos he's had a few decent results.

This is stupid and these people don't understand football. Its the club that football fans support not the manager.  

If a bad manager is destroying the club he deserves criticism if he turns things around or is replaced by a good manager then that manager deserves praise.

The club hasn't turned any corners yet and remains in a precarious position. End of February will give a more realistic picture of where we are. At that point fans can make an assessment and give the manager the praise or criticism he deserves. Nobody has got it in for Caldwell. If he has got the job under false pretences he should be booted out. If he has ability and brings success the fans will love him.

Football is played in the moment and opinions on a forum have a lifespan.

 

I agree with some of this but you've not been reading the forum properly. Some clearly have it in for Caldwell. From the Morton defeat onwards. I think the supporter supports both the team and the manager.....until such times as it becomes untenable. We still have a long way to go to turn this around.

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2 hours ago, Lenziejag said:

You need to read what I wrote. I said I don’t expect him to start not that he should be dropped.Caldwell said after the Stranraer game that he was pleased with Fitzpatrick, but that he needed to be protected.

Playing at Firhill is a different proposition to playing at Inverness.

My apologies for misinterpreting your post lenziejag.  It was the lack of a dissenting comment about Fitzpatrick being dropped that confused me.

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The constant criticism of everything the manager says or does really is draining. 

It's the same people saying the same thing, over and over again, until Caldwell says or does something else for them to jump on that as well so they can add that to their list. 

Caldwell has made mistakes, lots of them. His man management is questionable because of results since he took over. The Erskine situation lost him a lot of support and should have been handled better. He has made bad decisions during games that may have cost us points. At least he has had the balls to make decisions though.

He inherited a poor group of players with a losing record. He possibly thought he could steady the ship with that group of players but he couldn't. He has now been able to bring in players of his own and, since the turn of the year, performances have improved. 

Look at the players he has got rid of, or wants to get rid of - Storer, Melbourne, Scobbie, Erskine, Jeffries, Mutombo, Ntambwe, Keown, Bell. Out with Erskine, is anyone going to really make a case for any of the rest staying? He's identified the dross. He dropped the bomb scare of a defender that is McGinty.

The players look fitter than they did a few months ago, and we have been able to hold out for results in our three league games since the turn of the year that we may have squandered previously.

I get people don't like him and I get that we are in a poor position but the constant harping back to the interview or the SAS day or the player analysis is completely wearing. The guy is doing some things right.

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2 hours ago, Jag said:

 

I get people don't like him and I get that we are in a poor position but the constant harping back to the interview or the SAS day or the player analysis is completely wearing. The guy is doing some things right.

This. Just as wearing is the “Archie had got us more points than Caldwell” argument. Archie’s team was on the slide in terms of performance and confidence IMO.

Not convinced by Caldwell and he should undoubtedly have got more points in the board, but you can see some of the glaring deficiencies on the playing front being addressed. 

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3 hours ago, Jag said:

The constant criticism of everything the manager says or does really is draining. 

It's the same people saying the same thing, over and over again, until Caldwell says or does something else for them to jump on that as well so they can add that to their list. 

Caldwell has made mistakes, lots of them. His man management is questionable because of results since he took over. The Erskine situation lost him a lot of support and should have been handled better. He has made bad decisions during games that may have cost us points. At least he has had the balls to make decisions though.

He inherited a poor group of players with a losing record. He possibly thought he could steady the ship with that group of players but he couldn't. He has now been able to bring in players of his own and, since the turn of the year, performances have improved. 

Look at the players he has got rid of, or wants to get rid of - Storer, Melbourne, Scobbie, Erskine, Jeffries, Mutombo, Ntambwe, Keown, Bell. Out with Erskine, is anyone going to really make a case for any of the rest staying? He's identified the dross. He dropped the bomb scare of a defender that is McGinty.

The players look fitter than they did a few months ago, and we have been able to hold out for results in our three league games since the turn of the year that we may have squandered previously.

I get people don't like him and I get that we are in a poor position but the constant harping back to the interview or the SAS day or the player analysis is completely wearing. The guy is doing some things right.

Great post

Edited by jim slavin's lunchbox
And not a tree or a shrub in sight
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25 minutes ago, jim slavin's lunchbox said:

Great post

 

3 hours ago, Jag said:

The constant criticism of everything the manager says or does really is draining. 

It's the same people saying the same thing, over and over again, until Caldwell says or does something else for them to jump on that as well so they can add that to their list. 

Caldwell has made mistakes, lots of them. His man management is questionable because of results since he took over. The Erskine situation lost him a lot of support and should have been handled better. He has made bad decisions during games that may have cost us points. At least he has had the balls to make decisions though.

He inherited a poor group of players with a losing record. He possibly thought he could steady the ship with that group of players but he couldn't. He has now been able to bring in players of his own and, since the turn of the year, performances have improved. 

Look at the players he has got rid of, or wants to get rid of - Storer, Melbourne, Scobbie, Erskine, Jeffries, Mutombo, Ntambwe, Keown, Bell. Out with Erskine, is anyone going to really make a case for any of the rest staying? He's identified the dross. He dropped the bomb scare of a defender that is McGinty.

The players look fitter than they did a few months ago, and we have been able to hold out for results in our three league games since the turn of the year that we may have squandered previously.

I get people don't like him and I get that we are in a poor position but the constant harping back to the interview or the SAS day or the player analysis is completely wearing. The guy is doing some things right.

I agree and would also like to add in that we don't always have a team of players out injured all the time!

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6 hours ago, javeajag said:

This interview thing is getting wearisome.....can anyone who was present provide a transcript....I suspect he thought the players were better than they proved just like Archie but since we have brought in six so far and that could rise to eight it might be reasonable to conclude that the squad was worse than he thought once he was working with them

its his squad now and he will be judged on results 

I think its the Club who over sold him is the issue -and not what Caldwell said - the nonsense about the great interview created an unrealistic expectation - he has a long way to go before he wins the Fans over - If I was him I would say little & let results do the talking - the idea of relegation is frankly too scary to think about- and Im of the firm opinion we require large scale changes on multi levels at the Club - but for now not getting relegated will suffice 

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4 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

I think its the Club who over sold him is the issue -and not what Caldwell said - the nonsense about the great interview created an unrealistic expectation - he has a long way to go before he wins the Fans over - If I was him I would say little & let results do the talking - the idea of relegation is frankly too scary to think about- and Im of the firm opinion we require large scale changes on multi levels at the Club - but for now not getting relegated will suffice 

This, this and this.

All of it.

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What I find draining is...

- constant criticism of Archibald, who hasn't been our manager for about four months, as if everything is still about him

- constant reference to Caldwell's promotion target, which hasn't been realistic for months and is therefore just used as a stick to beat him

- any reference to Jackie McNamara, as if he is still relevant

- any reference to powerpoint

- watching Partick Thistle

- Brexit

- Dancing on Ice

- the 21st century in general

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