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46 minutes ago, Thistleberight said:

Would your clear out include the manager and his staff?

the players?

the chief exec?

the chairperson?

the youth coaches?

the board members?

This is my problem, I've no idea how deep the malaise runs, the incompetence runs, really I've no idea.

Here's the only example I can remember. Lambie's last return. We were Div 2 and going nowhere. As fans we were accepting and were waiting for a second coming from somebody, anybody. There was a deep rooted malaise and acceptance of what we had become, players, fans, board members and staff. 

When JL came in he didn't talk about players, single out who needed to go and who he wanted in. He didn't speak of what or who was wrong / not working. It was everything. Google his interviews from the time. He spoke of the WHOLE club being broken. Every single aspect of it and his first job was to "lift the place".

Are we at that stage again? Are we in a similar state? If we are then shame on those who have taken us back there. Once in a lifetime is enough for any jags fan.

 

Let's not kid ourselves on here. If we drop down AGAIN to Div 1, we are done, it's that serious  who would take us on to fix us? We are in danger of becoming a Clyde. Our gates are dropping, our core, I go every weekend, supporters are falling away  soon it'll just be those of us who have nothing else to do on a Saturday afternoon who are going to firhill. Sad times

All of this.

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24 minutes ago, Garscube Road End said:

The recent falling off a cliff suggests that the mentality of the players is weak. Bottom place and years in the wilderness beckons.

I'm not too convinced that the players' mentality is bust. The same players have seen games out recently that they wouldn't have before. I reckon team selection and substitutions may have played a bigger part than many would accept. Not sure if that should be taken as a positive. If for instance I'm right then I worry the manager will not recognize his errors. 

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12 minutes ago, lady-isobel-barnett said:

I'm not too convinced that the players' mentality is bust. The same players have seen games out recently that they wouldn't have before. I reckon team selection and substitutions may have played a bigger part than many would accept. Not sure if that should be taken as a positive. If for instance I'm right then I worry the manager will not recognize his errors. 

Looking at his managerial career, I don't think he recognizes errors.

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1 hour ago, Semi Nurainen said:

Much as I think the man is a clown, if I was being honest, strangely enough we might just squeeze it, possibly via the play offs.

In some ways that may only prolong our agony ...

Listened to the Sportsound podcast from Firhill , it was all very cordial from Gerry Britton, Dools and Scott McDonald and they spoke well , but I couldn’t believe that they were still talking about play off places , the sooner everyone within the Club accepts we’re head on in a relegation battle the more chance we’ve got of surviving, the remaining 10 games should be treated as cup finals if we’re going to stay in the League 

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Caldwell most definitely isn’t the solution, his apparent arrogance and inability to see when he gets it wrong or the acceptance of the magnitude of the situation we find ourself in.

Whilst for him or any manager to come in and completely reverse 18 months of decline on the park overnight would have been a near impossible task, he should have been able to steady the ship and reduce the bleeding till the transfer window, but he never. For that he should have walked.

Whilst his transfers and performances since new year till 3:45 on Saturday was an improvement, the teams we beat included Alloa, Stranraer and East Fife, hardly world class.  The collapse in last 2 games show we still have massive issues.

Caldwell though is only a symptom of a far bigger problem at the club, one that comes from the top.

They left the previous manager in too long , doing massive harm to the club and in fairness to Archibald

They brought in a replacement who had failed massively at his last 2 clubs

They appear not to have interviewed anyone else but been blown away with his presentation (PowerPoint or not)

Throughout all of this they keep harping on about promotion 

They announced the training complex would be ready by June and only when pressed by fans in January did they mention a problem but still pushing it will be ready in time (12 weeks from now)

They have known for months now about ticketsite issues yet even for our next game fans can’t buy tickets on line.

They place spin on all communications 

They have potentially left us exposed massively over Coulibally, even signing a guy who currently couldn’t play nor had played in a year was farcical for a club our size with limited squad size

 

They way things are going relegation could kill us as a club, yet the board don’t seem to get this, but it’s not their investment, their not died in the wool fans, they’ll move on to the next gig. Unfortunately we can’t 

 

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1 hour ago, Auld Jag said:

Looking at his managerial career, I don't think he recognizes errors.

AJ, I’m afraid this could be the case.

One might say that his limited  self-awareness in terms of how he comes across in the media (and how he might as a leader to the players), indicates that he perhaps he wouldn’t be humble enough to be open to learning different approaches.

And if that is the case, he is not the manager for Thistle who will deliver promotion to the top tier.

So, if you follow this logic, we need to replace him between now and August.

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3 hours ago, Garscube Road End said:

The recent falling off a cliff suggests that the mentality of the players is weak. Bottom place and years in the wilderness beckons.

I fear you are right. As we've seen before the manager part of the equation is crucial.

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1 hour ago, Norgethistle said:

Caldwell most definitely isn’t the solution, his apparent arrogance and inability to see when he gets it wrong or the acceptance of the magnitude of the situation we find ourself in.

Whilst for him or any manager to come in and completely reverse 18 months of decline on the park overnight would have been a near impossible task, he should have been able to steady the ship and reduce the bleeding till the transfer window, but he never. For that he should have walked.

Whilst his transfers and performances since new year till 3:45 on Saturday was an improvement, the teams we beat included Alloa, Stranraer and East Fife, hardly world class.  The collapse in last 2 games show we still have massive issues.

Caldwell though is only a symptom of a far bigger problem at the club, one that comes from the top.

They left the previous manager in too long , doing massive harm to the club and in fairness to Archibald

They brought in a replacement who had failed massively at his last 2 clubs

They appear not to have interviewed anyone else but been blown away with his presentation (PowerPoint or not)

Throughout all of this they keep harping on about promotion 

They announced the training complex would be ready by June and only when pressed by fans in January did they mention a problem but still pushing it will be ready in time (12 weeks from now)

They have known for months now about ticketsite issues yet even for our next game fans can’t buy tickets on line.

They place spin on all communications 

They have potentially left us exposed massively over Coulibally, even signing a guy who currently couldn’t play nor had played in a year was farcical for a club our size with limited squad size

 

They way things are going relegation could kill us as a club, yet the board don’t seem to get this, but it’s not their investment, their not died in the wool fans, they’ll move on to the next gig. Unfortunately we can’t 

 

Ran out of likes. Spot on.

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55 minutes ago, Norgethistle said:

Whilst for him or any manager to come in and completely reverse 18 months of decline on the park overnight would have been a near impossible task, he should have been able to steady the ship and reduce the bleeding till the transfer window, but he never. For that he should have walked

They left the previous manager in too long , doing massive harm to the club and in fairness to Archibald

They brought in a replacement who had failed massively at his last 2 clubs

Spot on.. even if Caldwell keeps us up with a few points to spare, he wouldn’t deserve to keep his job. That couldn’t be dressed up as anything other than failure and the support simply wouldn’t buy it. 

A mid table finish this season would probably see the board retain him but he would be under pressure from the start of next season. 

Either way I can’t see him seeing out his contract. If by the end of this season McCall decides he can’t take Ayr any further then the board should move for him. For me he’s the guy that started moving us forward after Campbell and laid the foundations for McNamara and Archie to take forward.

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6 hours ago, Thistleberight said:

Would your clear out include the manager and his staff?

the players?

the chief exec?

the chairperson?

the youth coaches?

the board members?

This is my problem, I've no idea how deep the malaise runs, the incompetence runs, really I've no idea.

Here's the only example I can remember. Lambie's last return. We were Div 2 and going nowhere. As fans we were accepting and were waiting for a second coming from somebody, anybody. There was a deep rooted malaise and acceptance of what we had become, players, fans, board members and staff. 

When JL came in he didn't talk about players, single out who needed to go and who he wanted in. He didn't speak of what or who was wrong / not working. It was everything. Google his interviews from the time. He spoke of the WHOLE club being broken. Every single aspect of it and his first job was to "lift the place".

Are we at that stage again? Are we in a similar state? If we are then shame on those who have taken us back there. Once in a lifetime is enough for any jags fan.

 

Let's not kid ourselves on here. If we drop down AGAIN to Div 1, we are done, it's that serious  who would take us on to fix us? We are in danger of becoming a Clyde. Our gates are dropping, our core, I go every weekend, supporters are falling away  soon it'll just be those of us who have nothing else to do on a Saturday afternoon who are going to firhill. Sad times

If we go down again this season, imo very few on the board,managerial side or playing side could be happy with their contribution to this season. We must be in the top 4 budgets and if we finished bottom, we would be unable to finish above a part time team. Like you I will still follow Thistle no matter what league we are in, but not everybody will. I just hope the board , manager and players realise just what a blow to our club another relegation would be.

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9 minutes ago, JAG1970 said:

Spot on.. even if Caldwell keeps us up with a few points to spare, he wouldn’t deserve to keep his job. That couldn’t be dressed up as anything other than failure and the support simply wouldn’t buy it. 

A mid table finish this season would probably see the board retain him but he would be under pressure from the start of next season. 

Either way I can’t see him seeing out his contract. If by the end of this season McCall decides he can’t take Ayr any further then the board should move for him. For me he’s the guy that started moving us forward after Campbell and laid the foundations for McNamara and Archie to take forward.

Agree with everything you say JAG1970. I think mid table is out of reach now. For me finishing 8th is the best we can expect this season. Sad but true.

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5 hours ago, Norgethistle said:

Caldwell most definitely isn’t the solution, his apparent arrogance and inability to see when he gets it wrong or the acceptance of the magnitude of the situation we find ourself in.

Whilst for him or any manager to come in and completely reverse 18 months of decline on the park overnight would have been a near impossible task, he should have been able to steady the ship and reduce the bleeding till the transfer window, but he never. For that he should have walked.

Whilst his transfers and performances since new year till 3:45 on Saturday was an improvement, the teams we beat included Alloa, Stranraer and East Fife, hardly world class.  The collapse in last 2 games show we still have massive issues.

Caldwell though is only a symptom of a far bigger problem at the club, one that comes from the top.

They left the previous manager in too long , doing massive harm to the club and in fairness to Archibald

They brought in a replacement who had failed massively at his last 2 clubs

They appear not to have interviewed anyone else but been blown away with his presentation (PowerPoint or not)

Throughout all of this they keep harping on about promotion 

They announced the training complex would be ready by June and only when pressed by fans in January did they mention a problem but still pushing it will be ready in time (12 weeks from now)

They have known for months now about ticketsite issues yet even for our next game fans can’t buy tickets on line.

They place spin on all communications 

They have potentially left us exposed massively over Coulibally, even signing a guy who currently couldn’t play nor had played in a year was farcical for a club our size with limited squad size

 

They way things are going relegation could kill us as a club, yet the board don’t seem to get this, but it’s not their investment, their not died in the wool fans, they’ll move on to the next gig. Unfortunately we can’t 

 

All out of likes. 

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1.

When Archie was finally binned, we were in 8th, 5 pts ahead of 9th and 6 pts ahead of 10th, and just 2 pts off of 4th.

Can anyone raise their hand and honestly say that they envisaged us to be, approaching 5 months later in March, sitting in 10th? - and 11 pts off 4th, and more points behind the league leaders than we have amassed in total?

 

2.

Especially after our chairman stated her pick to replace AA was the outstanding choice and that she was "blown away by Gary's interview preparation" and that "he had done an analysis of each player, identified a training schedule to deal with the fitness levels and pulled together a vision of how to get Thistle playing well enough to secure promotion,"

 

On these 2 points alone it is clear to everyone that the appointment of GC has been an abject and unmitigated disaster and failure, and both the chair and manager should be nowhere near Firhill by 1st June, no matter what position we finish in come 4.50pm on 4th May.

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23 minutes ago, north stander said:

1.

When Archie was finally binned, we were in 8th, 5 pts ahead of 9th and 6 pts ahead of 10th, and just 2 pts off of 4th.

Can anyone raise their hand and honestly say that they envisaged us to be, approaching 5 months later in March, sitting in 10th? - and 11 pts off 4th, and more points behind the league leaders than we have amassed in total?

 

2.

Especially after our chairman stated her pick to replace AA was the outstanding choice and that she was "blown away by Gary's interview preparation" and that "he had done an analysis of each player, identified a training schedule to deal with the fitness levels and pulled together a vision of how to get Thistle playing well enough to secure promotion,"

 

On these 2 points alone it is clear to everyone that the appointment of GC has been an abject and unmitigated disaster and failure, and both the chair and manager should be nowhere near Firhill by 1st June, no matter what position we finish in come 4.50pm on 4th May.

Well said, NS. 

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