Guest Posted May 14, 2019 Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 4 hours ago, javeajag said: To not offer a new contract to a player at the end of the season is what happens in every football club You're choosing not to get the point. It's how it was handled that is peeing everyone off. And for you to argueits just how football is, it to miss the point. Or perhaps you do but don't want to appear weak minded Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 14, 2019 Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 3 hours ago, jlsarmy said: Great we’ve got an opinion at last , didn’t think he had a right for a contract as you say that’s the managers call but there is a right way to treat people especially a player who has been with us for 10 years and in the middle of his testimonial year and contributed so much on and off the park . Surely this should have been dealt with better rather than Kris getting lumped in with the other free transfers ( McCarthy, Eadie etc ) I’m more critical of Gerry Britton and Jaqui Low for not showing any direction in this , whether that would have been a joint statement to suit both parties or at the very least have told Kris Doolan there was nothing on the table for him weeks before either coaching or playing. The way this has developed has not only put doubts into the minds of supporters about the manager but also the people who are actually running the Club. Even though there has been a backlash Gerry Britton and Jaqui Low have said absolutely nothing. I’ll be at Firhill tomorrow night , be interesting to hear what they’ve got to say . Ran out if likes. A very measured and direct post. Keep is none attendees updated please. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted May 14, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 4 hours ago, jlsarmy said: Great we’ve got an opinion at last , didn’t think he had a right for a contract as you say that’s the managers call but there is a right way to treat people especially a player who has been with us for 10 years and in the middle of his testimonial year and contributed so much on and off the park . Surely this should have been dealt with better rather than Kris getting lumped in with the other free transfers ( McCarthy, Eadie etc ) I’m more critical of Gerry Britton and Jaqui Low for not showing any direction in this , whether that would have been a joint statement to suit both parties or at the very least have told Kris Doolan there was nothing on the table for him weeks before either coaching or playing. The way this has developed has not only put doubts into the minds of supporters about the manager but also the people who are actually running the Club. Even though there has been a backlash Gerry Britton and Jaqui Low have said absolutely nothing. I’ll be at Firhill tomorrow night , be interesting to hear what they’ve got to say . Well I’ve said the same thing but maybe you didn’t notice hopefully we can get some clarity on Wednesday Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted May 14, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 1 hour ago, sandy said: You just play Devil’s Advocate to most posters on here. What’s your agenda? It’s a really weird one I want us to be successful but I notice facts cause you issues Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted May 14, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 48 minutes ago, Thistleberight said: And you clearly can't see the nose on the end of your face. We'll have to disagree on how our club, manager, board, team etc are performing. You carry on arguing that the team improved after Erskine left all you like. You'll never convince me Caldwell is "the man". If he takes us up, I'll certainly concede I was wrong. Still doesn't mean I have to like him. I never said you had to like Caldwell that’s up to you .... the did factually did improve after erskine left 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodstock Jag Posted May 14, 2019 Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 5 hours ago, javeajag said: How do you know ? The team improved and erskine had left Post hoc ergo propter hoc. Things not directly linked to Erskine leaving that changed at roughly the same time: Storer, Quitongo, Mutombo, Scobie, Bell, Lennox, Melbourne and Keown out. McDonald, Cardle, Mansell, Anderson, Saunders, McMillan, Hazard, Harkins and Roy in. The closest thing to a direct replacement was Erskine out Cardle in. Now Cardle was decent enough. But would it have made a big difference to the outcome of our season if Caldwell kept Erskine? I think it would have been much of a muchness. Which makes it hard to justify punting a club legend who on paper had all the attributes Caldwell claimed to want (hates losing, genuine character). The up-tick in our form far more plausibly can be explained by bringing in better replacements for Mutombo and Quitongo (i.e. McDonald and Mansell) and shoring up the defence (Keown and Scobie out for Saunders and Anderson). Towards the very end of our season, it’s even partly explained by the return of Shea Gordon from injury. It’s partly down to Caldwell getting Christie back on good form. Like I’ve said before, it’s baby out with the bathwater stuff that makes a lot of us angry. And it makes Caldwell’s attitude to this club feel super short term and like he’s looking out for number one instead of the One Team in Glasgow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlsarmy Posted May 14, 2019 Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 18 minutes ago, javeajag said: I never said you had to like Caldwell that’s up to you .... the did factually did improve after erskine left Not sure you’re actually getting it , Chris Erskine hardly played from November onwards, so that is factually incorrect since you seem to like your facts . They didn’t improve because Chris Erskine left because at that point he wasn’t even playing and hadn’t been for at least 2 months prior Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted May 14, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 4 minutes ago, jlsarmy said: Not sure you’re actually getting it , Chris Erskine hardly played from November onwards, so that is factually incorrect since you seem to like your facts . They didn’t improve because Chris Erskine left because at that point he wasn’t even playing and hadn’t been for at least 2 months prior In your opinion.... check what you said st the time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted May 14, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 6 minutes ago, Woodstock Jag said: Post hoc ergo propter hoc. Things not directly linked to Erskine leaving that changed at roughly the same time: Storer, Quitongo, Mutombo, Scobie, Bell, Lennox, Melbourne and Keown out. McDonald, Cardle, Mansell, Anderson, Saunders, McMillan, Hazard, Harkins and Roy in. The closest thing to a direct replacement was Erskine out Cardle in. Now Cardle was decent enough. But would it have made a big difference to the outcome of our season if Caldwell kept Erskine? I think it would have been much of a muchness. Which makes it hard to justify punting a club legend who on paper had all the attributes Caldwell claimed to want (hates losing, genuine character). The up-tick in our form far more plausibly can be explained by bringing in better replacements for Mutombo and Quitongo (i.e. McDonald and Mansell) and shoring up the defence (Keown and Scobie out for Saunders and Anderson). Towards the very end of our season, it’s even partly explained by the return of Shea Gordon from injury. It’s partly down to Caldwell getting Christie back on good form. Like I’ve said before, it’s baby out with the bathwater stuff that makes a lot of us angry. And it makes Caldwell’s attitude to this club feel super short term and like he’s looking out for number one instead of the One Team in Glasgow. If u can’t orive causality with erskine leaving ... how can you ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted May 14, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 3 minutes ago, Winter of '63 said: Some people like to play the Contrarian...but usually they are not as smart as they think they are...like Gary Caldwell. It's a bit surprising that a Poster has made nearly 3000 posts but I can't remember a single observation about a game he has actually been at. I leave responsibility for your memory to you .... but if you check ..,,, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted May 14, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 3 minutes ago, jlsarmy said: Come on mate “ 10 angry old men “ your quote One it is men two you appear angry three it is about ten Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paralytic thistle Posted May 14, 2019 Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 as usual Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted May 14, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 7 minutes ago, jlsarmy said: Nobody has mentioned what age they are on here or whether they are male or female To quote yourself “ facts “ “ you just made that up “ I think the contrast with the Facebook group is pretty stark but you will know better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlsarmy Posted May 14, 2019 Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 2 minutes ago, javeajag said: I think the contrast with the Facebook group is pretty stark but you will know better Maybe you should stick to that then , if it suits you better Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted May 14, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 Just now, jlsarmy said: Maybe you should stick to that then , if it suits you better Heh heh ..., just won £20 that you would say that .... cheers ! ps pushing people off the forum does you no credit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlsarmy Posted May 14, 2019 Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 1 minute ago, javeajag said: Heh heh ..., just won £20 that you would say that .... cheers ! ps pushing people off the forum does you no credit You win Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Passenger Posted May 14, 2019 Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 (edited) If we're being honest, I think a few of us suspected that this might have been Kris's last season at the club. There were signs that his iconic touch is beginning to desert him and he was missing the kind of chances - the one-on-one vs Alloa, for example - that other forwards would've been crucified for. Everyone knows why his goodwill account was still in credit, though, and that was reason enough, for me, to give him a one-year contract extension. I can also understand why his departure wasn't announced prior to the final match of the season. We needed to win. It was a day that required focus and positivity. There wasn't room for any sideshows. That being said, the decision must've been made by then. Caldwell knew what was coming and I suspect, due to his body language and his interactions with the fans at the final whistle, that Kris knew it too. But there was nothing to stop him getting a cameo appearance after Bannigan scored the decisive goal. Queens were dead and buried. That game was over. I can also understand to an extent the manner in which the announcement was made. Storey, McCarthy and Elliott used social media to announce their time at the club was over before the club was ready to make that announcement official. Can you image the outrage if news of Kris's departure had leaked prior to an official communique? As bad as the reaction from the fans has been, it would have been 100x worse if that had been the scenario. What I can't justify is denying Kris 10-15 minutes to contact those closest to him. Or failing to ask him if he wanted to contribute a statement to the official announcement. A little video montage of some of his goals wouldn't have gone amiss, either. Sh*t, a fan with some mobile footage managed that! It's also deeply insulting that he was being asked to fulfil ambassadorial duties 48 hours prior to his release. It might be a geographical thing - he visited Ayr Grammar Primary School - but to have him deliver a talk to pupils on resilience, to have one of the most professional, hard-working and legendary figures represent the club just before he was shown the door is a disgrace. Edited May 14, 2019 by Dark Passenger 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodstock Jag Posted May 14, 2019 Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 1 hour ago, javeajag said: If u can’t orive causality with erskine leaving ... how can you ? I'm not saying you can't draw a link. I'm saying you have to do more than draw a tenuous one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Rosebury Posted May 14, 2019 Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 3 hours ago, Dark Passenger said: It's also deeply insulting that he was being asked to fulfil ambassadorial duties 48 hours prior to his release. Do we know that he was asked to fulfil ambassadorial duties? Did he mention this during his Sportsound interview? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dl1971 Posted May 14, 2019 Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 5 hours ago, Dark Passenger said: If we're being honest, I think a few of us suspected that this might have been Kris's last season at the club. There were signs that his iconic touch is beginning to desert him and he was missing the kind of chances - the one-on-one vs Alloa, for example - that other forwards would've been crucified for. Everyone knows why his goodwill account was still in credit, though, and that was reason enough, for me, to give him a one-year contract extension. I can also understand why his departure wasn't announced prior to the final match of the season. We needed to win. It was a day that required focus and positivity. There wasn't room for any sideshows. That being said, the decision must've been made by then. Caldwell knew what was coming and I suspect, due to his body language and his interactions with the fans at the final whistle, that Kris knew it too. But there was nothing to stop him getting a cameo appearance after Bannigan scored the decisive goal. Queens were dead and buried. That game was over. I can also understand to an extent the manner in which the announcement was made. Storey, McCarthy and Elliott used social media to announce their time at the club was over before the club was ready to make that announcement official. Can you image the outrage if news of Kris's departure had leaked prior to an official communique? As bad as the reaction from the fans has been, it would have been 100x worse if that had been the scenario. What I can't justify is denying Kris 10-15 minutes to contact those closest to him. Or failing to ask him if he wanted to contribute a statement to the official announcement. A little video montage of some of his goals wouldn't have gone amiss, either. Sh*t, a fan with some mobile footage managed that! It's also deeply insulting that he was being asked to fulfil ambassadorial duties 48 hours prior to his release. It might be a geographical thing - he visited Ayr Grammar Primary School - but to have him deliver a talk to pupils on resilience, to have one of the most professional, hard-working and legendary figures represent the club just before he was shown the door is a disgrace. An excellent summation. Don't disagree at all. The Doolan departure has been handled very poorly. That s not just down to GC so I get the issue of where is Britton and Low. Maybe they are hanging GC out to dry on this. No matter what it didn't have to be this way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted May 14, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 1 hour ago, sandy said: And @javeajag, your ‘logic’ is so twisted it trips you up. Do you enjoy questioning fellow Jags fans opinions continually while rarely offering you own? Does it give you a kick? Hold up a mirror, I recommend. Wanting the club to be successful is an opinion ! like my opinion on your love affair with Archie that got us here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 14, 2019 Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 10 hours ago, javeajag said: I never said you had to like Caldwell that’s up to you .... the did factually did improve after erskine left Sorry, wrong. Did not factually did not improve etc etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 14, 2019 Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 8 hours ago, javeajag said: Heh heh ..., just won £20 that you would say that .... cheers ! ps pushing people off the forum does you no credit Are you partaking of alcohol? None of your posts make any sense tonight. Sorry for you that they've cancelled Jeremy kyle, we'd have made a perfect appearance what with all our bickering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
javeajag Posted May 14, 2019 Author Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 3 minutes ago, Thistleberight said: Are you partaking of alcohol? None of your posts make any sense tonight. Sorry for you that they've cancelled Jeremy kyle, we'd have made a perfect appearance what with all our bickering. At least you acknowledged ‘our’ bickering.....but you choose to respond to a post not directed at you .....resist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 14, 2019 Report Share Posted May 14, 2019 Just now, javeajag said: At least you acknowledged ‘our’ bickering.....but you choose to respond to a post not directed at you .....resist I can't help myself, despite all the doctors warnings. Good morning in Oz. I trust you slept well, refreshed for the jousting ahead Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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