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A night with GC


dl1971
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Wasn't at the meeting so can't comment on that. But to update the old saying of 'football is not won on paper' 'football is not won on a power point'. But I do hope that Caldwell doesn't just talk a good game and we do have a good season, which means we need to be at the very least in the play offs by the end of 2019/20.

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3 hours ago, jaf said:

For the reasons given in my post, I think that's not really success, thats what anyone should be able to do - we are talking about a well paid manager here who wa recruited to achieve promotion and this will be two transformative transfer windows on - surely we can expect better than 'par'?

BTW, I expected us to be 5th last season so not known for being unrealistic!

 

Thinking about this logically and having got past my dislike for our manager and my intent on a fresh start may I say this? We were told by the chair and Board, when GC was appointed and also by GC himself that his target was promotion. This didn't happen for a variety of reasons we have all discussed and we all have our own thoughts and some will not be dissuaded otherwise which is all healthy and good.

So, as you have said jaf, this coming season, it has, on the basis of what we have been told before, to be promotion. Nothing more nothing less. GC has to get us promoted or it is a failure, by his and the chairs own barometer. 

Clean slate. His players, his signings and even those signed by AA are now his players. I hate what GC and jlow and GB did to doooooolan, but for me anyway, next season will start with a clean slate. It's the only way forward.

Sandy, you and I have chatted about the set up in terms of board, manager, coaching, academy etc and we agree on pretty much everything. But, the current situation we find ourselves in isn't healthy for us going forward as a club. Please don't take a hiatus, the club needs our support, can I not persuade you to re consider. We don't have to like Caldwell but could I talk you in to starting the season off with a clean slate, let GC start again, give the team and manager our support? That's not to say anyone will be exempt from any criticism even after the first game though. 

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I don't believe that finishing in a play off position should necessarily be seen as a success. Finishing in the play off zone with a strong nucleus of players potentially capable of playing in the top tier would be a success. Much as we need experienced players it's unsustainable over a longer period to overload the team with old heads. Trust the pressure on Caldwell to succeed doesn't demand going too "tried and tested".

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1 hour ago, javeajag said:

I must go back and remind myself who max melbourne was.....Archie’s squad was utter mince let’s not rewrite history

We know you and sandy hate Caldwell with a passion but I’m not sure what attacking him daily in every issue is meant to achieve 

he will be here next season and if results are good he will stay and if not I expect he won’t last till Xmas ....why not just accept that and move on ? 

Come on Jave, Max Melbourne played 3 times in the first team , hopefully its a bit more balanced than that , the squad that Caldwell inherited wasn’t good enough but it was squad/ fringe team players we got rid of in January not regular first team players.

Wasn’t really attacking him as such just saying that you’ve got to appraise his tenure as a whole not just conveniently from January.

He came across last night as very single minded on his thoughts and his aims for PTFC so I think everyone is on the same page there .

Didnt necessarily agree with style of play , possession based with a 3 at the back with the wing backs pushing on , we had only 6 assists from the wing backs all season ( 4 for Christie and 2 for Penrice) , definitely need a creative midfield player to unlock defences , Banzo being a perfect example , good in retaining the ball but no assists all season. Agreed with him re the counter press game that he likes but you’ve got to have the whole team doing it not just some of them and possibly the defence a further 10 yards up the park , possibly couldn’t do that last season because of Anderson’s lack of pace .

Don’t think he said he made any mistakes at all since he started with PTFC

Wasn’t attacking him as such only trying to offer a balance somewhere along the line , and yeah you’re right we start again next season .

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29 minutes ago, lady-isobel-barnett said:

I don't believe that finishing in a play off position should necessarily be seen as a success. Finishing in the play off zone with a strong nucleus of players potentially capable of playing in the top tier would be a success. Much as we need experienced players it's unsustainable over a longer period to overload the team with old heads. Trust the pressure on Caldwell to succeed doesn't demand going too "tried and tested".

Agree LIB , think we can’t just throw money at it and go for the quick fix, it’s got to sustainable over a period of time with a mixture of youth and experienced players. Even if we did get a play off place next year ,to actually get through all the play off games and go up is a big ask .

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54 minutes ago, jlsarmy said:

Come on Jave, Max Melbourne played 3 times in the first team , hopefully its a bit more balanced than that , the squad that Caldwell inherited wasn’t good enough but it was squad/ fringe team players we got rid of in January not regular first team players.

Wasn’t really attacking him as such just saying that you’ve got to appraise his tenure as a whole not just conveniently from January.

He came across last night as very single minded on his thoughts and his aims for PTFC so I think everyone is on the same page there .

Didnt necessarily agree with style of play , possession based with a 3 at the back with the wing backs pushing on , we had only 6 assists from the wing backs all season ( 4 for Christie and 2 for Penrice) , definitely need a creative midfield player to unlock defences , Banzo being a perfect example , good in retaining the ball but no assists all season. Agreed with him re the counter press game that he likes but you’ve got to have the whole team doing it not just some of them and possibly the defence a further 10 yards up the park , possibly couldn’t do that last season because of Anderson’s lack of pace .

Don’t think he said he made any mistakes at all since he started with PTFC

Wasn’t attacking him as such only trying to offer a balance somewhere along the line , and yeah you’re right we start again next season .

Ok.......but let’s agree the past is the past.....he will be judged next season correctly on results as it will be his team etc.....if we don’t make progress then he will deserve to go....in the meantime I hope he’s successful ! 

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3 hours ago, Thistle88 said:

Forgot about Mcginty who for the last 4 or 5 games out with McDonald was our best player.. i wanted him gone after half the season, but he's completely changed my mind. The only thing is can be play like that without some1 like Anderson talking him through the game? Time will tell.

Selectively quoting your paragraph about the Mighty McGinty. What happened to April Player of the Month. I was going to vote for Big Sean.

He is also very good at clapping the fans. 

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6 hours ago, javeajag said:

Ok.......but let’s agree the past is the past.....he will be judged next season correctly on results as it will be his team etc.....if we don’t make progress then he will deserve to go....in the meantime I hope he’s successful ! 

So your barometer of success is 'make progress'?   With the likely configuration of the league next season it is almost impossible not to make progress IMO!

If as you urge, people should leave the past behind and start with a clean slate (which I agree with wholeheartedly) then you need a realistic measure of success rather than GC already being let off the hook for next season by people managing expectations downwards.

 

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7 hours ago, partickthedog said:

Selectively quoting your paragraph about the Mighty McGinty. What happened to April Player of the Month. I was going to vote for Big Sean.

He is also very good at clapping the fans. 

And that's worth a goal of a start. I do hope that Thomas o'ware will strike up a good partnership with McGinty.

Think I said it before, if big Sean concentrates on the simple stuff he's a great asset. It's when he tries to be clever with the chic charnley crossfield passes that he falls down. As you and thistle88 say, he was much improved.

On a side note, at times Sean looked the stronger centre half between he and Anderson in April.

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If we're going again with the three centrebacks (signing Williamson adds to that likelihood) then it's imperative that at least one (preferably two) are comfortable driving forward and don't get nose bleeds up in the opponents half. Surprisingly for a big fella I think McGinty is well equipped to get up the pitch. He's none too slow with the ball at his feet. Ideally tho' you want the centre of the back three to be breaking forward but that's not crucial. 

What I'm unsure of is whether GC will go with Saunders-O'Ware-McGinty or O'Ware-Saunders-McGinty. Probably the former. 

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I see our manager is a guest on Friday Sports Panel on 5 Live at 1300 hours today. Will it be cos he won and FA cup with Wigan (English FA cup final tomorrow), or will it be an in depth interview around his management of the glorious Partick Thistle?

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Things I noticed at the meeting 

GCs presentation to players on his day one was shown. He literally set out his standards and stuck to them 

He mentioned Klopp and Guardiola a lot. Clearly his heroes.

His first criterion for signing a player was their character, mindset and attitude. Other things came later

Many Klopp interviews showing that when he first meets a potential player, they never discuss football, just life.

He showed his outlines of each player type he wanted in January 2019 and then literally turned it into a quiz . The screen showed the attributes he wanted and he literally asked us: “right who is that then?” And we knew right away 

 

When Ally Roy’s name came up, the crowd made a few noises. He looked and said “well, I cannae get them all right”

He made several self effacing remarks about PowerPoints and joined in at laughing at himself 

He said that his girlfriend slags him off for his dull and boring interviews where he doesn’t actually say anything. He says he’s in game mode and doesn’t want to give the opponent any advantage. He told the story of being burned by this at Wigan and asked fans to support this as well. See the Frank Lampard derby song as well 

He was honest about Couleybaly. When we spoke I said we were glad to know the truth now but I encouraged him to keep secrets from the fans if ultimately it helps the club at the time ... he can explain later 

On that point, the SFA have forced the club to never comment on the Doolan ghost goal. I’d love to see that letter one day 

Caldwell seems like a genuinely nice, caring man who wants to learn and improve himself and this club. I’ve no doubt he’d want the Celtic or Scotland job one day.

But he has a mean streak and is tough . He has 55 caps for Scotland and has played in champions league and won the FA cup. He does not mess about 

 

Given his sense of humour we really should have a song about him.,.,, where is Manpreet??

“We’re better than you 

We’re better than you

its on Gary’s PowerPoint 

We’re better than you”

 

 

this will be a good season 

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29 minutes ago, gerrybritton9 said:

Things I noticed at the meeting 

GCs presentation to players on his day one was shown. He literally set out his standards and stuck to them 

He mentioned Klopp and Guardiola a lot. Clearly his heroes.

His first criterion for signing a player was their character, mindset and attitude. Other things came later

Many Klopp interviews showing that when he first meets a potential player, they never discuss football, just life.

He showed his outlines of each player type he wanted in January 2019 and then literally turned it into a quiz . The screen showed the attributes he wanted and he literally asked us: “right who is that then?” And we knew right away 

 

When Ally Roy’s name came up, the crowd made a few noises. He looked and said “well, I cannae get them all right”

He made several self effacing remarks about PowerPoints and joined in at laughing at himself 

He said that his girlfriend slags him off for his dull and boring interviews where he doesn’t actually say anything. He says he’s in game mode and doesn’t want to give the opponent any advantage. He told the story of being burned by this at Wigan and asked fans to support this as well. See the Frank Lampard derby song as well 

He was honest about Couleybaly. When we spoke I said we were glad to know the truth now but I encouraged him to keep secrets from the fans if ultimately it helps the club at the time ... he can explain later 

On that point, the SFA have forced the club to never comment on the Doolan ghost goal. I’d love to see that letter one day 

Caldwell seems like a genuinely nice, caring man who wants to learn and improve himself and this club. I’ve no doubt he’d want the Celtic or Scotland job one day.

But he has a mean streak and is tough . He has 55 caps for Scotland and has played in champions league and won the FA cup. He does not mess about 

 

Given his sense of humour we really should have a song about him.,.,, where is Manpreet??

“We’re better than you 

We’re better than you

its on Gary’s PowerPoint 

We’re better than you”

 

 

this will be a good season 

I’ve no doubt he’d want the Scotland or Celtic job too. But with respect I’d suggest that there’s a better chance of Coulibaly being captain next year than there is of Caldwell being within a mile of either of those jobs. 

Edited by KemoAvdiu
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5 hours ago, jaf said:

So your barometer of success is 'make progress'?   With the likely configuration of the league next season it is almost impossible not to make progress IMO!

If as you urge, people should leave the past behind and start with a clean slate (which I agree with wholeheartedly) then you need a realistic measure of success rather than GC already being let off the hook for next season by people managing expectations downwards.

 

I wasn’t really addressing the progress point but the objective is promotion so we need to be in contention for the automatic place and then the playoffs ..., if we are where he inherited the team come Nov his time will be up 

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I personally think this could be his last shot at Management. If he doesn’t get it right this time, I’d be very surprised if any other Club in Britain went near him.  He’s had too many failures in a young career already so he’ll be doubly determined to a good job here.  He’s made a few mistakes and owned up to a few of them.  Hopefully he learns from them and doesn’t repeat them and his next job is a step up after a very successful spell with Patrick Thistle.

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50 minutes ago, Willjag said:

I personally think this could be his last shot at Management. If he doesn’t get it right this time, I’d be very surprised if any other Club in Britain went near him.  He’s had too many failures in a young career already so he’ll be doubly determined to a good job here.  He’s made a few mistakes and owned up to a few of them.  Hopefully he learns from them and doesn’t repeat them and his next job is a step up after a very successful spell with Patrick Thistle.

Mods, please! 

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4 hours ago, gerrybritton9 said:

Things I noticed at the meeting 

GCs presentation to players on his day one was shown. He literally set out his standards and stuck to them 

He mentioned Klopp and Guardiola a lot. Clearly his heroes.

His first criterion for signing a player was their character, mindset and attitude. Other things came later

Many Klopp interviews showing that when he first meets a potential player, they never discuss football, just life.

He showed his outlines of each player type he wanted in January 2019 and then literally turned it into a quiz . The screen showed the attributes he wanted and he literally asked us: “right who is that then?” And we knew right away 

 

When Ally Roy’s name came up, the crowd made a few noises. He looked and said “well, I cannae get them all right”

He made several self effacing remarks about PowerPoints and joined in at laughing at himself 

He said that his girlfriend slags him off for his dull and boring interviews where he doesn’t actually say anything. He says he’s in game mode and doesn’t want to give the opponent any advantage. He told the story of being burned by this at Wigan and asked fans to support this as well. See the Frank Lampard derby song as well 

He was honest about Couleybaly. When we spoke I said we were glad to know the truth now but I encouraged him to keep secrets from the fans if ultimately it helps the club at the time ... he can explain later 

On that point, the SFA have forced the club to never comment on the Doolan ghost goal. I’d love to see that letter one day 

Caldwell seems like a genuinely nice, caring man who wants to learn and improve himself and this club. I’ve no doubt he’d want the Celtic or Scotland job one day.

But he has a mean streak and is tough . He has 55 caps for Scotland and has played in champions league and won the FA cup. He does not mess about 

 

Given his sense of humour we really should have a song about him.,.,, where is Manpreet??

“We’re better than you 

We’re better than you

its on Gary’s PowerPoint 

We’re better than you”

 

 

this will be a good season 

How dare you be positive and optimistic!

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2 hours ago, Willjag said:

I personally think this could be his last shot at Management. If he doesn’t get it right this time, I’d be very surprised if any other Club in Britain went near him.  He’s had too many failures in a young career already so he’ll be doubly determined to a good job here.  He’s made a few mistakes and owned up to a few of them.  Hopefully he learns from them and doesn’t repeat them and his next job is a step up after a very successful spell with Patrick Thistle.

Will,  allow me to offer you this explanation from the penmanship of Britain's greatest author J K Rowling....

"I make mistakes like the next man. In fact, being--forgive me--rather cleverer than most men, my mistakes tend to be correspondingly huger"

 

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16 hours ago, javeajag said:

I wasn’t really addressing the progress point but the objective is promotion so we need to be in contention for the automatic place and then the playoffs ..., if we are where he inherited the team come Nov his time will be up 

Actually, in the history of the current set up no team that finished 3rd or 4th has made it to the playoff final(or maybe it is not promoted).

So the target has to be 1st or 2nd.

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47 minutes ago, gerrybritton9 said:

Caldwell appreciates McGinty’s madness/braveness of his forays forward with the ball!!!

so much so he’s saying “ oh look it’s big Franco Baresi” ..... not realising that the team are too young to know who Baresi is !!!! Ha ha 

So on the back of all this optimism, I guess the fact that Gordon and cardle have "re signed" is an indication that there is a happy dressing room or they wouldn't have come near the place again having escaped. I am sharing this optimism cos that's one of the traits that makes us Thistle fans. I'm still, though struggling with the mad cap way that the dools release was handled and the lack of communication from jlow and GB to wards the fans but then again I guess there's been more important thing to attend to than that given our precarious position for most of the season. 

Just a footnote that the board and team management need to take their customers in the journey with them. Without us there is no club. We are the lifeblood and at times recently have been taken for granted somewhat. One really important issue that needs addressed is a fan appointment to the board even just as an observer. So there is a direct line of communication. Perhaps there could be a voting system through season ticket or trust members, if fans were to put themselves forward for the task. Just thinking out loud

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