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By Jag
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douglas clark
Message added by douglas clark

'Tis not the job of a moderator to stop people writing here. The rules are pretty simple:

reported ad hominem attacks will be investigated (and if found to be true) or write stuff that could get the site into trouble

and you'll either be warned / your post deleted, or - worst case scenario -  banned either temporarily or permanently.

This particular thread has had a vigorous exchange of views, and perhaps more heat than light. But the quality of the debate - it seems to me at least - is down to the lack of information.  That, in and of itself, means that whatever side you happen to be on is for a fan, very frustrating.

So, I have no intention of closing threads just because the quality of the postings isn't great. That is not the role of a moderator.

If you wake up the following morning you can always delete something you wish you'd never said.

 

 

 

 

 

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jaf Jags fan

jaf

Posted
Posted

One thing is clear that people have concerns about this. And that’s fair enough. 

I think we have been really let down by the constitution of the supporters trust. If that was constituted as in my opinion it ought to be with all representatives being supporters we would have a voice. And a substantial one. 

Because of the utterly contemptible hybrid that seems to have been established (frankly for no purpose other than to make the supporters trust impotent and protect the board) , one would imagine status quo when any new owners come along  

a glorious missed opportunity  

mind you perhaps not  maybe someone somewhere is still writing the constitution after al no one seems to have seen it?! 

 

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javeajag Jags fan

javeajag

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, jaf said:

One thing is clear that people have concerns about this. And that’s fair enough. 

I think we have been really let down by the constitution of the supporters trust. If that was constituted as in my opinion it ought to be with all representatives being supporters we would have a voice. And a substantial one. 

Because of the utterly contemptible hybrid that seems to have been established (frankly for no purpose other than to make the supporters trust impotent and protect the board) , one would imagine status quo when any new owners come along  

a glorious missed opportunity  

mind you perhaps not  maybe someone somewhere is still writing the constitution after al no one seems to have seen it?! 

 

Spot on 

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AndyMac Jags fan

AndyMac

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

Ok ask yourself this - Why Now - this was obviously a complicated deal to pull together - not all parties know each other that well - Some of them dont even like each other - but what changed over the End of Last Season for this to happen ? For a proactive joining of forces to occur - now you could say Money - but at least a third of those involved are very wealthy -there Thistle Fans - there not selling the Club down the River for in there Nett Worth - not a lot 

So people need to ask themselves - Why ?  Something was the Catalyst for such a dramatic change ? 

   

All good points JJ, I don't know why, I haven't got a clue. Nevertheless, I don't like the look of it one little bit.

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Jordanhill Jag Jags fan

Jordanhill Jag

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, AndyMac said:

All good points JJ, I don't know why, I haven't got a clue. Nevertheless, I don't like the look of it one little bit.

Fair Enough - but whilst the focus is on the New Buyers - it does seem very very strange that this has been pulled together - lets face it not an easy task - so what do the former Directors Know that we dont ? its not all about cashing in - there are say 9 - at least three of them gave the Money to support the Club - zero interest in ever seeing it again  - a Third the owners haven't a connection to the Club anymore so fair enough get a pay out - why not ?  - a Third get some cash-  but only if it benefits PTFC 

Knowing them all - thats my take on it - but something changed - why now - why so dramatic a change after all these Years - lets face it - we have seen worse times ?

So why Now ? 

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AndyMac Jags fan

AndyMac

Posted
Posted
46 minutes ago, javeajag said:

Yes you are correct but atm the moment they will buy 52-55% of the shares but I still don’t get what the ‘packaging ‘ is and where the profit comes from. ? 

The package is the land (Firhill) rolled together it's worth much more than in separate parts. The consortium will then be able to make money from the sale of the land.

Because no one is saying that this is going to happen doesn't mean that it's not going to happen. It may take a little time to rear its head, but lets not forget, their stated aim is to make money and I can't see how else they're going to do it.

Perhaps I am wrong. Time will tell.

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Third Lanark Jags fan

Third Lanark

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

Fair Enough - but whilst the focus is on the New Buyers - it does seem very very strange that this has been pulled together - lets face it not an easy task - so what do the former Directors Know that we dont ? its not all about cashing in - there are say 9 - at least three of them gave the Money to support the Club - zero interest in ever seeing it again  - a Third the owners haven't a connection to the Club anymore so fair enough get a pay out - why not ?  - a Third get some cash-  but only if it benefits PTFC 

Knowing them all - thats my take on it - but something changed - why now - why so dramatic a change after all these Years - lets face it - we have seen worse times ?

So why Now ? 

As I’ve already said to you why now, you must have a fair idea? Are you personally in contact with many of them?

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javeajag Jags fan

javeajag

Posted
Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, AndyMac said:

The package is the land (Firhill) rolled together it's worth much more than in separate parts. The consortium will then be able to make money from the sale of the land.

Because no one is saying that this is going to happen doesn't mean that it's not going to happen. It may take a little time to rear its head, but lets not forget, their stated aim is to make money and I can't see how else they're going to do it.

Perhaps I am wrong. Time will tell.

You mean with all the property developers we have had on the board from Jim Oliver onwards who couldn’t make any land or property deal work these guys turn up and hey  presto ! Fir hill is worth millions ?! 

Sell the land to who for what .., it’s been tried and it’s not going to happen 

why on earth would these guys be interested in a land transaction in maryhill he makes more overnight on a treasury deposit ! 

Edited by javeajag
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allyo Jags fan

allyo

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, javeajag said:

You mean with all the property developers we have had on the board from Jim Oliver onwards who couldn’t make any land or property deal work these guys turn up and hey  presto ! Fir hill is worth millions ?! 

Sell the land to who for what .., it’s been tried and it’s not going to happen 

why on earth would these guys be interested in a land transaction in maryhill he makes more overnight on a treasury deposit ! 

Maybe the property people before were inhibited by their wish to also run a football club?

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AndyMac Jags fan

AndyMac

Posted
Posted
59 minutes ago, jaf said:

Honestly this is just fantasy. 

1 they couldn’t do it under company law

2 they have shown no appetite to do it at Barnsley 

3 you are ignoring the fact they are not buying entitlement to 100 per cent of an asset but actually only 55% 

4 you are also ignoring the fact that the club are a shareholder in propco 

 

 

I don't claim to know all the facts or be an expert on company law etc.

What I do know is that money talks and that the rich and powerful often do as they please, leaving a trail of debt misery and disaster in their wake.

This consortium has put Nice £20 Million in debt at an interest rate of 9%. That's not "fantasy" Jaf ,  it's reality.

 

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javeajag Jags fan

javeajag

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, allyo said:

Maybe the property people before were inhibited by their wish to also run a football club?

Why would a billionaires from America and Asia be interested in making a couple of million in a property deal in maryhill ?

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javeajag Jags fan

javeajag

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, AndyMac said:

I don't claim to know all the facts or be an expert on company law etc.

What I do know is that money talks and that the rich and powerful often do as they please, leaving a trail of debt misery and disaster in their wake.

This consortium has put Nice £20 Million in debt at an interest rate of 9%. That's not "fantasy" Jaf ,  it's reality.

 

You would be lucky to put us in debt of say £3m and 9% of that is less than £300k .... you think they would buy us for that ?!!

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Big Col Jags fan

Big Col

Posted
Posted

A lot of speculation and supposition on here. Let’s wait and see what they say (if it does indeed go ahead).

Personally I see it as an opportunity for an exciting new era for the Jags with experienced businessmen & women running the club upstairs, a good management team in the dugout and an exciting quality team on the pitch.

Time will tell.

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allyo Jags fan

allyo

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, javeajag said:

Why would a billionaires from America and Asia be interested in making a couple of million in a property deal in maryhill 

I don't know. I don't know their motives. And nor do you. Obviously we both hope for the best. You're just more optimistic than me.

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AndyMac Jags fan

AndyMac

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, javeajag said:

You would be lucky to put us in debt of say £3m and 9% of that is less than £300k .... you think they would buy us for that ?!!

No, that's not how it works, they sell the assets, keep the cash and saddle the debt with the club.

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javeajag Jags fan

javeajag

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, AndyMac said:

No, that's not how it works, they sell the assets, keep the cash and saddle the debt with the club.

You still haven’t said what asset they would sell and to who for what 

if you saddle the club with debt no one buys it .... yes ?

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AndyMac Jags fan

AndyMac

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, javeajag said:

You still haven’t said what asset they would sell and to who for what 

if you saddle the club with debt no one buys it .... yes ?

They will buy the club for less than it's worth.

They will then sell the ground to re coup the money they used to buy it in the first instance and also pocket a tidy profit.

The club will be left with no ground and a large debt.

Who will buy the club off them? No one, that's who. They don't care, it doesn't matter, they have their money. Game over.

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javeajag Jags fan

javeajag

Posted
Posted
Just now, AndyMac said:

They will buy the club for less than it's worth.

They will then sell the ground to re coup the money they used to buy it in the first instance and also pocket a tidy profit.

The club will be left with no ground and a large debt.

Who will buy the club off them? No one, that's who. They don't care, it doesn't matter, they have their money. Game over.

Sell the ground to who ? For what use ?

sell the club to who , who would buy it in those circumstances ?

how much money do you think they would make ? And why ?!

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Dark Passenger Jags fan

Dark Passenger

Posted
Posted (edited)
12 hours ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

Knowing them all - thats my take on it - but something changed - why now - why so dramatic a change after all these Years - lets face it - we have seen worse times ?

So why Now ? 

Why not spit it out?

You've been in contact with people to tell them existing shareholders are unhappy with the way the club's being run. You've also claimed, without evidence, that the club's run up losses of over £500,000.

You're claiming it's an altruistic move. That, as you would say, is PR spin. 

Truth is, someone -- has been introduced to Mr Lee and a number of shareholders are desperate to sell their shares to him, whatever the true cost to Partick Thistle FC.

You probably don't give a hoot what I think, but I'd have more respect for you, and them, if you were honest.

Edited by admin
Probably best to steer clear of mentioning specific names unless you are going to provide evidence to back that up. Same re JJ although he is active enough to reply/provide denial if required. Be careful.
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