New Owner

[jaf]

6 hours ago, AndyMac said:

This might be a better question.

The Partick Thistle Football Club Trust has Trustees, this we know.

It is one thing to say that supporters are beneficiaries, however, how many supporters have actually been made beneficiaries? How many Jags fans have a legally binding document stating that they're beneficiaries of the Partick Thistle Football Club Trust?

There must be at least few hundred supporters known to the club, that meet the criteria to be card carrying beneficiaries of the Partick Thistle Football Club Trust?

There must be a good number on this forum?

Andy.  This issue has been brought up repeatedly.  We ought to be able to see a constitution as we are members of something we cannot see the rules of. It’s jut not transparent. 

Of more concern is why this is not a simple thing to do  surely the constitution is readily available?   Also for those who are trustees, if it were me and I was becoming a trustee of something (as indeed I am of a few charities etc), first thing I would do before signing on dotted line before becoming a trustee is examine the constitution to ensure there are no personal risks and pitfalls in the role  

if it is controlled by the board, it is an absolute misnomer to call this a supporters trust  

i thought it was a wonderful thing what Colin weir did in terms of paying off the debt and gifting shares to a supporters trust  however if this is what he intended (which I cannot personally believe), then it wasn’t such a wonderful thing  if it’s not what he intended, he has been let down in the implementation phase by the board and/or professional advisors  

 

 

[Big Dan]

6 hours ago, AndyMac said:

This might be a better question.

The Partick Thistle Football Club Trust has Trustees, this we know.

It is one thing to say that supporters are beneficiaries, however, how many supporters have actually been made beneficiaries? How many Jags fans have a legally binding document stating that they're beneficiaries of the Partick Thistle Football Club Trust?

There must be at least few hundred supporters known to the club, that meet the criteria to be card carrying beneficiaries of the Partick Thistle Football Club Trust?

There must be a good number on this forum?

I must be one through the Season Ticket criteria, but was completely unaware of this until I read it (probably on here) a few weeks back.

If we are share holders, we should officially  be informed of this. In some cases,  Companies may require employees  who hold positions on Boards of Charities or Trusts etc to declare any shares held, or if they have an interest in any Company or Trust. We cannot declare what we are not aware of.

Is our ST share status registered anywhere?

[KemoAvdiu]

55 minutes ago, jaf said:

Andy.  This issue has been brought up repeatedly.  We ought to be able to see a constitution as we are members of something we cannot see the rules of. It’s jut not transparent. 

Of more concern is why this is not a simple thing to do  surely the constitution is readily available?   Also for those who are trustees, if it were me and I was becoming a trustee of something (as indeed I am of a few charities etc), first thing I would do before signing on dotted line before becoming a trustee is examine the constitution to ensure there are no personal risks and pitfalls in the role  

if it is controlled by the board, it is an absolute misnomer to call this a supporters trust  

i thought it was a wonderful thing what Colin weir did in terms of paying off the debt and gifting shares to a supporters trust  however if this is what he intended (which I cannot personally believe), then it wasn’t such a wonderful thing  if it’s not what he intended, he has been let down in the implementation phase by the board and/or professional advisors  

 

 

This ^

The Trust is an absolute sham. Whether the people involved have disengaged through choice or design, the end result has been an invisible and powerless organisation that seems to have been set up to be exactly that. Such a wasted opportunity. 

Edited June 27, 2019 by KemoAvdiu

[javeajag]

1 hour ago, jaf said:

Andy.  This issue has been brought up repeatedly.  We ought to be able to see a constitution as we are members of something we cannot see the rules of. It’s jut not transparent. 

Of more concern is why this is not a simple thing to do  surely the constitution is readily available?   Also for those who are trustees, if it were me and I was becoming a trustee of something (as indeed I am of a few charities etc), first thing I would do before signing on dotted line before becoming a trustee is examine the constitution to ensure there are no personal risks and pitfalls in the role  

if it is controlled by the board, it is an absolute misnomer to call this a supporters trust  

i thought it was a wonderful thing what Colin weir did in terms of paying off the debt and gifting shares to a supporters trust  however if this is what he intended (which I cannot personally believe), then it wasn’t such a wonderful thing  if it’s not what he intended, he has been let down in the implementation phase by the board and/or professional advisors  

 

 

Absolutely correct.....the fact that we don’t know who the trustees are, what it’s constitution is, and how it operates tells you all yiu need to know 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, KemoAvdiu said:

This ^

The Trust is an absolute sham. Whether the people involved have disengaged through choice or design, the end result has been an invisible and powerless organisation that seems to have been set up to be exactly that. Such a wasted opportunity. 

I cant disagree but there was a "stand" at a few home games last season and I seem to remember someone on here posting don't think anyone approached them. If they are visible and no one engages then what's the point? Or is the arguement that cos we don't know what they are for nor what they represent nor for that matter what if any influence or say they have at board level it's in itself pointless. 

That said why does no one approach and challenge the representatives at these events (such as they are).

[KemoAvdiu]

1 hour ago, Thistleberight said:

I cant disagree but there was a "stand" at a few home games last season and I seem to remember someone on here posting don't think anyone approached them. If they are visible and no one engages then what's the point? Or is the arguement that cos we don't know what they are for nor what they represent nor for that matter what if any influence or say they have at board level it's in itself pointless. 

That said why does no one approach and challenge the representatives at these events (such as they are).

In 2019 a stall in one stand before matches doesn’t constitute an engagement strategy.

 

Edited June 27, 2019 by KemoAvdiu

[ARu-Strathbungo]

So this was posted on this forum at the end of March by a forum member  'JAGS TRUST':-

All members are invited to the Annual General Meeting of Partick Thistle Supporters Association (trading as “The Jags Trust”) which will take place on Saturday 6 April 2019 at 12 o’clock.

The meeting will be held in the Chairman’s Lounge, in the Colin Weir Stand, entering from Firhill Road.

We are delighted to say that our meeting will be opened by guest and speaker Gerry Britton PTFC Ltd Chief Executive and followed by the business matters of the AGM.

I think it would be a good idea if the Jags Trust posted some clarifications on their role within PTFC, and clarified the differences between themselves and, The Partick Thistle Football Club Trust  

Perhaps a bit of the history explaining why there are two 'supporters association' would be a good idea, followed by a broad brush overview of the aims of each association ,and  finally how to become a member of either.

[For information I have been a member of the Jags Trust in the past, but renewing membership is tricky as the online membership links no longer work. When I asked for a paper renewal form there was no reply, so I am at a loss as to how to proceed]

[West of Scotland]

Thirty five pages based on absolutely nothing but half a rumour.

Pie & Bovril has a dedicated subthread for Old Firm fans to goad each other. This forum would benefit greatly from a similar dedicated place for the handful of posters who turn every single thread into tedious game of playing with themselves.

 

[AndyMac]

"It was asked if the Trust Deed would be available online for supporters to read. It was noted that fans could review the Trust Deed at the Club Offices, however there was currently no intention to publish the deed online."

PTFC Trust meeting – 18th May 2016

[AndyMac]

The Partick Thistle Football Club Trust is a legal entity that owns 20% of the club.

As we know Trustees have been appointed by the club. The appointed Trustees control what happens to this 20% share of the club.

The legal beneficiaries of the Trust are Thistle"supporters". The qualifying criteria to become a beneficiary is to hold a season ticket for the past 3 seasons. Season ticket holders details are obviously known to the club.

If the Trustees decided that it was in the best interests of the club to sell the shares to the consortium. The beneficiaries of the Trust would be entitled to any financial gain.

So, a Trust was set up to the benefit of supporters. Does anyone know of any supporter that's actually a certified beneficiary of the Trust?

There must be a few on here, surely?

[lady-isobel-barnett]

19 hours ago, allyo said:

It's like your local family run pub being bought over by a big brewer. You might get fancy new seats and tables, a wider selection of drinks. They might make bigger profits, and be a more professionally run operation all round.

But it's just not the same any more.

And then when they stop making a profit they sell it and it gets turned into a bookies.

The analogy with a pub is accurate. In fact re the poster who mentioned "by all means" would any Jags fans by happy to accept a name change to Trans Global Thistle or whatever the parent company wants? Just saying as whatever safeguards are put into the takeover agreement further down the line we could be at the complete mercy of the owner. 

I think if you're honest with yourself and want to see us successful "by all means" then you should include a name change, which could inject millions into the Club, into your dream. Maybe less dramatic hows-about a change of strip to represent whatever corporate colours are applicable? Point I'm making, albeit in an over the top manner, is that we as fans will have lost control of any restraints we currently have power over. Bums on seats at Firhill (or Trans Global/Whatever Stadium) will be of little concern to a company investing monies with a totally different business plan.

[javeajag]

16 minutes ago, AndyMac said:

The Partick Thistle Football Club Trust is a legal entity that owns 20% of the club.

As we know Trustees have been appointed by the club. The appointed Trustees control what happens to this 20% share of the club.

The legal beneficiaries of the Trust are Thistle"supporters". The qualifying criteria to become a beneficiary is to hold a season ticket for the past 3 seasons. Season ticket holders details are obviously known to the club.

If the Trustees decided that it was in the best interests of the club to sell the shares to the consortium. The beneficiaries of the Trust would be entitled to any financial gain.

So, a Trust was set up to the benefit of supporters. Does anyone know of any supporter that's actually a certified beneficiary of the Trust?

There must be a few on here, surely?

I would qualify on season tickets and I did get the email about the meeting don’t recall getting anything else 

[Jordanhill Jag]

36 minutes ago, AndyMac said:

"It was asked if the Trust Deed would be available online for supporters to read. It was noted that fans could review the Trust Deed at the Club Offices, however there was currently no intention to publish the deed online."

PTFC Trust meeting – 18th May 2016

Ok Wow  - so a Supporters Trust whose prime role is to engage with the Supporters doesn't want its deed in the Public Domain ? that is frankly the most bizarre statement regards a Supporters Trust Ive ever read 

Well done for bringing this up Andy - So Im assuming this was the Collective Decision of the Trustees - and Im assuming same Trustees are  Thistle Fans ?  

[AndyMac]

Again this is speculation.

We all seem to under the impression that it's long term Thistle shareholders that have come together to sell the club. Many are re assured by this, as they know these people through their actions and deeds over many years and understandably believe that they've the best interests of the club at heart.

Say it's not the long term share holders, perhaps it could be the Weir's wanting to sell their personal share (for whatever reason) combined with the shares of the Partick Thistle Football Club Trust. This comes in at just under 30% of the club.

If this is the case. It really puts a different light on things.

[Firhillista]

Over 800 posts and 30,000 views on this thread and all we really know is that we don't know anything.

Is the consortium that's supposed to be buying the club this week still interested?

Have they turned their attentions elsewhere? (They've already approached, and been knocked back by, Hibs, allegedly, and Falkirk have, apparently, been approached by 'American investors'.)

'I think we should be told' is usually a facetious punchline in these situations, but I think we SHOULD be told, even if it's only, "The club has been approached by a group interested in investing in Thistle and we are in discussions. No further comment will be made at this time."

The chair has made a great deal about openness, transparency and good communication. Surely this is the time.

[jagfox]

Any perspective owner would probably want to take over Firhill Developments Limited (Propco) as well? 

Nature of business (SIC)

• 68100 - Buying and selling of own real estate

[Dick Dastardly]

1 hour ago, AndyMac said:

Again this is speculation.

We all seem to under the impression that it's long term Thistle shareholders that have come together to sell the club. Many are re assured by this, as they know these people through their actions and deeds over many years and understandably believe that they've the best interests of the club at heart.

Say it's not the long term share holders, perhaps it could be the Weir's wanting to sell their personal share (for whatever reason) combined with the shares of the Partick Thistle Football Club Trust. This comes in at just under 30% of the club.

If this is the case. It really puts a different light on things.

or maybe they were contacted, but nobody was interested in selling and the investors have gone away

[Dick Dastardly]

1 hour ago, Firhillista said:

Over 800 posts and 30,000 views on this thread and all we really know is that we don't know anything.

Is the consortium that's supposed to be buying the club this week still interested?

Have they turned their attentions elsewhere? (They've already approached, and been knocked back by, Hibs, allegedly, and Falkirk have, apparently, been approached by 'American investors'.)

'I think we should be told' is usually a facetious punchline in these situations, but I think we SHOULD be told, even if it's only, "The club has been approached by a group interested in investing in Thistle and we are in discussions. No further comment will be made at this time."

The chair has made a great deal about openness, transparency and good communication. Surely this is the time.

But the chair may know as little as we do. Remember that the board (as has been reported ad infinitum on here) are not share holders, so will have had little need for contact with anyone wanting to buy any shares that may, or may not be up for sale.

[javeajag]

1 hour ago, Firhillista said:

Over 800 posts and 30,000 views on this thread and all we really know is that we don't know anything.

Is the consortium that's supposed to be buying the club this week still interested?

Have they turned their attentions elsewhere? (They've already approached, and been knocked back by, Hibs, allegedly, and Falkirk have, apparently, been approached by 'American investors'.)

'I think we should be told' is usually a facetious punchline in these situations, but I think we SHOULD be told, even if it's only, "The club has been approached by a group interested in investing in Thistle and we are in discussions. No further comment will be made at this time."

The chair has made a great deal about openness, transparency and good communication. Surely this is the time.

Probably read this Thread........

[AndyMac]

13 minutes ago, Dick Dastardly said:

But the chair may know as little as we do. Remember that the board (as has been reported ad infinitum on here) are not share holders, so will have had little need for contact with anyone wanting to buy any shares that may, or may not be up for sale.

Perhaps the chair is babysitting 30% of the shares and trying to shepherd another 21% to make a sale?

Who knows?

As the old saying goes - there's no smoke without fire - somethings gone/going on.

 

[AndyMac]

22 minutes ago, Dick Dastardly said:

or maybe they were contacted, but nobody was interested in selling and the investors have gone away

Perhaps.

They could make a statement to this effect and put an end to much of the speculation.

Why haven't they?

[Dick Dastardly]

21 minutes ago, AndyMac said:

Perhaps.

They could make a statement to this effect and put an end to much of the speculation.

Why haven't they?

Why haven't who ?

What is the medium for the current shareholders to do so ? As I said, the board may not know any more than we do and the current shareholders are all private individuals.

[javeajag]

I tend to think if nothing was in the air one of the shareholders would ha e said so 

[jaf]

Perhaps there are confidentiality clauses associated with any offer? That would not be uncommon.

Or there are other reasons things may have stalled for the moment - ultimately time will tell and we ordinary fans cannot control the process.

 

 

 

[Jordanhill Jag]

From Memory The Board have to approve the Transfer of any Shares ( this may have changed - not sure ) 

Its therefore not impossible that there is discussions going on 

For the Record - No idea if there is or isnt