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Jag
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Message added by douglas clark

'Tis not the job of a moderator to stop people writing here. The rules are pretty simple:

reported ad hominem attacks will be investigated (and if found to be true) or write stuff that could get the site into trouble

and you'll either be warned / your post deleted, or - worst case scenario -  banned either temporarily or permanently.

This particular thread has had a vigorous exchange of views, and perhaps more heat than light. But the quality of the debate - it seems to me at least - is down to the lack of information.  That, in and of itself, means that whatever side you happen to be on is for a fan, very frustrating.

So, I have no intention of closing threads just because the quality of the postings isn't great. That is not the role of a moderator.

If you wake up the following morning you can always delete something you wish you'd never said.

 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, admin said:

I really don't understand the resentment towards Colin Weir who seems, not just in football, a genuinely altruistic individual. 

In this case he is funding the share purchase not funding the Club. A distinction that appears lost on some. 

I think the issue is that with Money comes Power and the more Money the more Power - but it also brings responsibility - therefore Colin Weir is responsible for who he puts in place to Run the Club 

And to suddenly decide that TFE are the way forward based on what exactly  but the existing Board  couldnt make contact frankly doesnt sit well 

But you seem convinced that TFE / Weir are  our future - I think it will be a Carcrash as I have ZERO faith in TFE 

And again I will repeat this isnt anti Fan Ownership - I simply do not want  TFE taking over the Club using Colin Weirs Money 

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8 hours ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

That assumes that the person that you made contact with was OK with you speaking to Colin Weir - therefore as you have confirmed you cant make direct Contact with him - so in essence your talking nonsense ref not trying very hard 

You are probably right with your assumption that he couldn’t make direct contact, but he only said he had to make 2 phone calls and Colin Weir called him back. He might have left a message ?

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1 minute ago, Fawlty Towers said:

If I recall correctly the last comment from David Beattie on the takeover issue was that he believed there would be more clarity within 3-4 weeks and we are in that period now so let's hope we are moving towards this being resolved.

Hallowe'en deadline?

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7 hours ago, admin said:

Agreed and every time the figure of £10million is quoted people should make reference to this. 

Whether through intent or not it is misleading to suggest, even inadvertently,  that Colin Weir is providing new funds to the Club. 

So just as a brief summary if the TfE purchase of shares is concluded the following would be the case:

The Club would continue to be funded as it currently is. 

The pledges, which current stand at £50,000pa represents new, additional income. 

Members of the Club Board would be appointed precisely as members of the BoD are currently appointed. 

After the purchase of shares has been concluded Colin Weir's financial relationship with the Club returns to what it was pre Boardroom coup. 

Things that will change:

The ownership of Partick Thistle. The Club would now be owned by the supporters of Partick Thistle Football Club. 

Admin,

I am not knocking this, but i think that it needs to be explained how the supporters will be owners. Only if they make a pledge before the takeover. ? Or what is the way to become an owner after the takeover.

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6 hours ago, admin said:

Agreed and every time the figure of £10million is quoted people should make reference to this. 

Whether through intent or not it is misleading to suggest, even inadvertently,  that Colin Weir is providing new funds to the Club. 

So just as a brief summary if the TfE purchase of shares is concluded the following would be the case:

The Club would continue to be funded as it currently is. 

The pledges, which current stand at £50,000pa represents new, additional income. 

Members of the Club Board would be appointed precisely as members of the BoD are currently appointed. 

After the purchase of shares has been concluded Colin Weir's financial relationship with the Club returns to what it was pre Boardroom coup. 

Things that will change:

The ownership of Partick Thistle. The Club would now be owned by the supporters of Partick Thistle Football Club. 

Those pledges of £50k will never 100% materialize or last long term. Look to Hearts or Dundee or Stirling (50000 signed up according to our own TFE guy) to see the actual percentage of those interested Vs those who contribute, then check those who start contributing to those still doing it 1 year later.

268 people are interested, more contributed to Maryhill FC crowdfunding, it’s less than 10% of the fanbase. This does not appear to be what the majority of the fanbase wants.

The timing and rhetoric behind TFE causes alarms, whilst the old board was in place, no mention.  Low etc get ousted and suddenly this new fan ownership backed by Weir (Low’s employer) enters the fray.  Despite being told Weir wasn’t involved it was obvious he was this came to fruition.

TFE still won’t confirm or deny other people (who I know are) are involved, why?

When the initial talk of the consortium was mentioned, and prior to the board being changed why were shareholders being called by a (certain) individual stating he was acting on behalf of the club (never employed by to my knowledge) enquiring about purchasing shareholders shares? I know 2 shareholders approached this way.  Was this anything to do with the club, the old board or just a prank cold call?

The Partick Thistle trust (Which our previous Chairman was on and set up by Weir) puts a statement out stating it backs TFE and Beattie has done no due diligence (Rubbished at AGM) on the same night that TFE launch the press release that Colin Weir is bankrolling it.

The model for running the club has been rolled out prior to any voting etc, effectively having a two tier board. One selected one Elected, the power is not with the elected. The control has been decided upfront. The elected board will be the same as the JT board member, a puppet.


Im still not sold on consortium, but what TFE is not is fan ownership or control.  Check the time line of events, the press leaks etc, there is a coordinated PR and Spin campaign going around this which is way above 4 fans level.


I also struggle with why anyone would buy a company and gift its value and running of to complete strangers. Why would you not ensure your substantial investment and outlay was being managed properly either by yourself or by your own man or woman doing it for you. 

Weir academy was set up to eventually become self sufficient with transfer fees funding future running costs, it was also a community based project almost charitable status. When the investment in the club was given it wasn’t controlling and some of those shares were held, with the other lot gifted to a Trust where his person had a say, as was on the club board where he invested. 

My fear is this becomes a Brooks Milesom  (Gretna) scenario, when Weirs funding stops the club stops. With business men like Springford or Gilfillan involved they have the ability if need be to prevent a cash flow issue bankrupting the club, which could impact their ability to be a director at their other companies. How does this model do that if Weir can’t or won’t plug any shortfall. Will the 4 or 5 TFE guys take a loan from the bank? Also with 2 boards will that be another 5 or 10 wages or will they do it for free or (as previously done under Beattie) pay an annual fee for being in that board position.

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41 minutes ago, Norgethistle said:

Those pledges of £50k will never 100% materialize or last long term. Look to Hearts or Dundee or Stirling (50000 signed up according to our own TFE guy) to see the actual percentage of those interested Vs those who contribute, then check those who start contributing to those still doing it 1 year later.

268 people are interested, more contributed to Maryhill FC crowdfunding, it’s less than 10% of the fanbase. This does not appear to be what the majority of the fanbase wants.

The timing and rhetoric behind TFE causes alarms, whilst the old board was in place, no mention.  Low etc get ousted and suddenly this new fan ownership backed by Weir (Low’s employer) enters the fray.  Despite being told Weir wasn’t involved it was obvious he was this came to fruition.

TFE still won’t confirm or deny other people (who I know are) are involved, why?

When the initial talk of the consortium was mentioned, and prior to the board being changed why were shareholders being called by a (certain) individual stating he was acting on behalf of the club (never employed by to my knowledge) enquiring about purchasing shareholders shares? I know 2 shareholders approached this way.  Was this anything to do with the club, the old board or just a prank cold call?

The Partick Thistle trust (Which our previous Chairman was on and set up by Weir) puts a statement out stating it backs TFE and Beattie has done no due diligence (Rubbished at AGM) on the same night that TFE launch the press release that Colin Weir is bankrolling it.

The model for running the club has been rolled out prior to any voting etc, effectively having a two tier board. One selected one Elected, the power is not with the elected. The control has been decided upfront. The elected board will be the same as the JT board member, a puppet.


Im still not sold on consortium, but what TFE is not is fan ownership or control.  Check the time line of events, the press leaks etc, there is a coordinated PR and Spin campaign going around this which is way above 4 fans level.


I also struggle with why anyone would buy a company and gift its value and running of to complete strangers. Why would you not ensure your substantial investment and outlay was being managed properly either by yourself or by your own man or woman doing it for you. 

Weir academy was set up to eventually become self sufficient with transfer fees funding future running costs, it was also a community based project almost charitable status. When the investment in the club was given it wasn’t controlling and some of those shares were held, with the other lot gifted to a Trust where his person had a say, as was on the club board where he invested. 

My fear is this becomes a Brooks Milesom  (Gretna) scenario, when Weirs funding stops the club stops. With business men like Springford or Gilfillan involved they have the ability if need be to prevent a cash flow issue bankrupting the club, which could impact their ability to be a director at their other companies. How does this model do that if Weir can’t or won’t plug any shortfall. Will the 4 or 5 TFE guys take a loan from the bank? Also with 2 boards will that be another 5 or 10 wages or will they do it for free or (as previously done under Beattie) pay an annual fee for being in that board position.

I would prefer the status quotas it stands but I’m surprised at your comment your are still not sold on the consortium- I had the impression that you were very much in favour of the consortium 

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59 minutes ago, Norgethistle said:

Those pledges of £50k will never 100% materialize or last long term. Look to Hearts or Dundee or Stirling (50000 signed up according to our own TFE guy) to see the actual percentage of those interested Vs those who contribute, then check those who start contributing to those still doing it 1 year later.

268 people are interested, more contributed to Maryhill FC crowdfunding, it’s less than 10% of the fanbase. This does not appear to be what the majority of the fanbase wants.

The timing and rhetoric behind TFE causes alarms, whilst the old board was in place, no mention.  Low etc get ousted and suddenly this new fan ownership backed by Weir (Low’s employer) enters the fray.  Despite being told Weir wasn’t involved it was obvious he was this came to fruition.

TFE still won’t confirm or deny other people (who I know are) are involved, why?

When the initial talk of the consortium was mentioned, and prior to the board being changed why were shareholders being called by a (certain) individual stating he was acting on behalf of the club (never employed by to my knowledge) enquiring about purchasing shareholders shares? I know 2 shareholders approached this way.  Was this anything to do with the club, the old board or just a prank cold call?

The Partick Thistle trust (Which our previous Chairman was on and set up by Weir) puts a statement out stating it backs TFE and Beattie has done no due diligence (Rubbished at AGM) on the same night that TFE launch the press release that Colin Weir is bankrolling it.

The model for running the club has been rolled out prior to any voting etc, effectively having a two tier board. One selected one Elected, the power is not with the elected. The control has been decided upfront. The elected board will be the same as the JT board member, a puppet.


Im still not sold on consortium, but what TFE is not is fan ownership or control.  Check the time line of events, the press leaks etc, there is a coordinated PR and Spin campaign going around this which is way above 4 fans level.


I also struggle with why anyone would buy a company and gift its value and running of to complete strangers. Why would you not ensure your substantial investment and outlay was being managed properly either by yourself or by your own man or woman doing it for you. 

Weir academy was set up to eventually become self sufficient with transfer fees funding future running costs, it was also a community based project almost charitable status. When the investment in the club was given it wasn’t controlling and some of those shares were held, with the other lot gifted to a Trust where his person had a say, as was on the club board where he invested. 

My fear is this becomes a Brooks Milesom  (Gretna) scenario, when Weirs funding stops the club stops. With business men like Springford or Gilfillan involved they have the ability if need be to prevent a cash flow issue bankrupting the club, which could impact their ability to be a director at their other companies. How does this model do that if Weir can’t or won’t plug any shortfall. Will the 4 or 5 TFE guys take a loan from the bank? Also with 2 boards will that be another 5 or 10 wages or will they do it for free or (as previously done under Beattie) pay an annual fee for being in that board position.

What questions have you asked the consortium ? Did they answer ? 
 

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2 hours ago, Norgethistle said:

Those pledges of £50k will never 100% materialize or last long term. Look to Hearts or Dundee or Stirling (50000 signed up according to our own TFE guy) to see the actual percentage of those interested Vs those who contribute, then check those who start contributing to those still doing it 1 year later.

268 people are interested, more contributed to Maryhill FC crowdfunding, it’s less than 10% of the fanbase. This does not appear to be what the majority of the fanbase wants.

The timing and rhetoric behind TFE causes alarms, whilst the old board was in place, no mention.  Low etc get ousted and suddenly this new fan ownership backed by Weir (Low’s employer) enters the fray.  Despite being told Weir wasn’t involved it was obvious he was this came to fruition.

TFE still won’t confirm or deny other people (who I know are) are involved, why?

When the initial talk of the consortium was mentioned, and prior to the board being changed why were shareholders being called by a (certain) individual stating he was acting on behalf of the club (never employed by to my knowledge) enquiring about purchasing shareholders shares? I know 2 shareholders approached this way.  Was this anything to do with the club, the old board or just a prank cold call?

The Partick Thistle trust (Which our previous Chairman was on and set up by Weir) puts a statement out stating it backs TFE and Beattie has done no due diligence (Rubbished at AGM) on the same night that TFE launch the press release that Colin Weir is bankrolling it.

The model for running the club has been rolled out prior to any voting etc, effectively having a two tier board. One selected one Elected, the power is not with the elected. The control has been decided upfront. The elected board will be the same as the JT board member, a puppet.


Im still not sold on consortium, but what TFE is not is fan ownership or control.  Check the time line of events, the press leaks etc, there is a coordinated PR and Spin campaign going around this which is way above 4 fans level.


I also struggle with why anyone would buy a company and gift its value and running of to complete strangers. Why would you not ensure your substantial investment and outlay was being managed properly either by yourself or by your own man or woman doing it for you. 

Weir academy was set up to eventually become self sufficient with transfer fees funding future running costs, it was also a community based project almost charitable status. When the investment in the club was given it wasn’t controlling and some of those shares were held, with the other lot gifted to a Trust where his person had a say, as was on the club board where he invested. 

My fear is this becomes a Brooks Milesom  (Gretna) scenario, when Weirs funding stops the club stops. With business men like Springford or Gilfillan involved they have the ability if need be to prevent a cash flow issue bankrupting the club, which could impact their ability to be a director at their other companies. How does this model do that if Weir can’t or won’t plug any shortfall. Will the 4 or 5 TFE guys take a loan from the bank? Also with 2 boards will that be another 5 or 10 wages or will they do it for free or (as previously done under Beattie) pay an annual fee for being in that board position.

The shareholders dont need to take Colin Weirs money. It's simple. Then we have the status quo. I dont have a problem with that. If they have reservations they wont sell their shares unless they are content the club is in safe hands. Or am I missing something? 

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2 hours ago, Norgethistle said:

Those pledges of £50k will never 100% materialize or last long term. Look to Hearts or Dundee or Stirling (50000 signed up according to our own TFE guy) to see the actual percentage of those interested Vs those who contribute, then check those who start contributing to those still doing it 1 year later.

268 people are interested, more contributed to Maryhill FC crowdfunding, it’s less than 10% of the fanbase. This does not appear to be what the majority of the fanbase wants.

The timing and rhetoric behind TFE causes alarms, whilst the old board was in place, no mention.  Low etc get ousted and suddenly this new fan ownership backed by Weir (Low’s employer) enters the fray.  Despite being told Weir wasn’t involved it was obvious he was this came to fruition.

TFE still won’t confirm or deny other people (who I know are) are involved, why?

When the initial talk of the consortium was mentioned, and prior to the board being changed why were shareholders being called by a (certain) individual stating he was acting on behalf of the club (never employed by to my knowledge) enquiring about purchasing shareholders shares? I know 2 shareholders approached this way.  Was this anything to do with the club, the old board or just a prank cold call?

The Partick Thistle trust (Which our previous Chairman was on and set up by Weir) puts a statement out stating it backs TFE and Beattie has done no due diligence (Rubbished at AGM) on the same night that TFE launch the press release that Colin Weir is bankrolling it.

The model for running the club has been rolled out prior to any voting etc, effectively having a two tier board. One selected one Elected, the power is not with the elected. The control has been decided upfront. The elected board will be the same as the JT board member, a puppet.


Im still not sold on consortium, but what TFE is not is fan ownership or control.  Check the time line of events, the press leaks etc, there is a coordinated PR and Spin campaign going around this which is way above 4 fans level.


I also struggle with why anyone would buy a company and gift its value and running of to complete strangers. Why would you not ensure your substantial investment and outlay was being managed properly either by yourself or by your own man or woman doing it for you. 

Weir academy was set up to eventually become self sufficient with transfer fees funding future running costs, it was also a community based project almost charitable status. When the investment in the club was given it wasn’t controlling and some of those shares were held, with the other lot gifted to a Trust where his person had a say, as was on the club board where he invested. 

My fear is this becomes a Brooks Milesom  (Gretna) scenario, when Weirs funding stops the club stops. With business men like Springford or Gilfillan involved they have the ability if need be to prevent a cash flow issue bankrupting the club, which could impact their ability to be a director at their other companies. How does this model do that if Weir can’t or won’t plug any shortfall. Will the 4 or 5 TFE guys take a loan from the bank? Also with 2 boards will that be another 5 or 10 wages or will they do it for free or (as previously done under Beattie) pay an annual fee for being in that board position.

Ok let’s go through this ....

1. the pledges may or may not be £50k ....you imply they will be lower so let’s assume half  £25k thats still additional revenue ....that also discounts more fans getting involved and pledging more 

2, I’m not aware we have asked the fan base  what they want so it’s an assumption on your part but to  be even handed do we think the fan base want the consortium.....hard to see

3, I struggle with this  point ....simply on the actual chronology tfe emerged after the old board was sacked and the consortium bid for  the club was announced .....that doesnt seem strange foreign unknown venture capitalists bid for  your club , fans get concerned and stuff happens ....where’s the conspiracy ?

4. the consortium won’t say whose involved or why .....disgrace evil !

5. you are implying some kind of conspiracy ....could you just spell it out so we can all understand it ? it may be terrible or it may be good but what is it your getting at ?

6. Your asking gquestions about buying shares you don’t seem to know anything about ? ! What’s its significance?


7. the so called model as I understand it is a proposal it’s not a legally binding done deal 

8. The fact that you can’t envisage someone doing a benevolent act might lead some people to think you work in financial services .....

9. I am not aware that Colin weir has done anything in respect of the club that involved him having any day to day involvement 

10. at no time apart from critics of Colin weir has he suggested he is funding the club day to day 

11.  Any fears or concerns with the consortium like ....who are they , why are they here , what are their plans , how are the funding the purchase etc etc 

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