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javeajag

Thistle For Ever - Fans Ownership

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2 hours ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

"It is essential that, every Board member will have to be a member of the supporters’ group that appoints the Board" 

Interesting statement from the Thistle Forever Website - so the Supporters Group will exclusively appoint the Board   - so what about the other 49% of the Shareholders - does there views not count - also you could be a Season Ticket Holder & a Shareholder but if your not in the "Gang"  your excluded from standing for elections  to the Board - is this the New Democracy ?   

Fans with the requisite skills and experience will be able to apply but it won’t be possible for someone without the appropriate skills to simply be voted onto the Board

Who decides what the requisite Skills are ?  - the Thistle Forever Trustees ? - Paul Goodwin ?  - Who decides on the "appropriate skills " - Paul Goodwin ? Now it all sounds very professional but here is my issue - Yes they are right to question what Direction the Clubs going in - but by definition that implies they were happy with the previous incumbents- otherwise they would have launched this previously ?   Also if they dont hit the targets - but a benefactor offers to fund the purchase - but wants there own couple of people on the Board - are they going to say No ?   

Nor will it be possible for anyone to ‘buy’ a seat on the Board.

 

 Interesting that you have gone so detailed and so negative on this idea whilst being very supportive of the takeover with even less information available

im sure a lot of these details are up for grabs particularly if the two trusts came together and the idea looked to have some traction 

it’s an ownership that has Motherwell and st mirren in the premiership while privately owned us laguishes

How you work out they were happy with the previous board form all this is an fabulous exercise in illogical logic 

It’s like me saying your in favour of the takeover because you have a significant shareholding in the club

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We've heard more from this group in just 24 hours than we’ve heard from the consortium. They’ve laid out their approach. They’ve been open to questions via social media,  providing answers quickly and openly. They’ve made themselves available to the media and have accepted challenge. As a fan I value that more than a mystery consortium and a group of shareholders who are party to key detail but won’t engage with us in any way. 

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7 minutes ago, javeajag said:

 Interesting that you have gone so detailed and so negative on this idea whilst being very supportive of the takeover with even less information available

im sure a lot of these details are up for grabs particularly if the two trusts came together and the idea looked to have some traction 

it’s an ownership that has Motherwell and st mirren in the premiership while privately owned us laguishes

How you work out they were happy with the previous board form all this is an fabulous exercise in illogical logic 

It’s like me saying your in favour of the takeover because you have a significant shareholding in the club

Motherwell “fan ownership” has actually been funded by Les Hutchison, with the Well Society needing to pay him every 6 months and have a minimum of 2000 members paying a minimum of £10 a month. They have been in operation for 5 years and have not as yet achieved fan ownership.

St Mirren are paying back the guy that purchased the shares  on their behalf to have one elected board member

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1 minute ago, Norgethistle said:

Motherwell “fan ownership” has actually been funded by Les Hutchison, with the Well Society needing to pay him every 6 months and have a minimum of 2000 members paying a minimum of £10 a month. They have been in operation for 5 years and have not as yet achieved fan ownership.

St Mirren are paying back the guy that purchased the shares  on their behalf to have one elected board member

Yes I knew that and it’s one way to do it......as I said earlier this looks the Falkirk model to me which us a slightly different approach.....though our Thistle minded shareholders could gift their shares to the trust to achieve fan ownership earlier particularly as apparently none of them really need the money from selling 

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If the scheme is successful, it will dilute the current Shareholders Group (the sellers) to a level that they wish, or we would seek to buy their shareholding completely.

 

Would this not require the existing shareholders (including the 9) to allow this?

 

I see the timescale is January 2020, say the consortium buys next week?

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Just now, javeajag said:

Yes I knew that and it’s one way to do it......as I said earlier this looks the Falkirk model to me which us a slightly different approach.....though our Thistle minded shareholders could gift their shares to the trust to achieve fan ownership earlier particularly as apparently none of them really need the money from selling 

If it’s Falkirk model, then the goal appears to raise circa £1.2 million by January, with a 2500 adult fan base. 

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2 minutes ago, Norgethistle said:

If it’s Falkirk model, then the goal appears to raise circa £1.2 million by January, with a 2500 adult fan base. 

That’s my assumption .....but why don’t our rich shareholders donate their shares to the trust ?

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5 minutes ago, javeajag said:

That’s my assumption .....but why don’t our rich shareholders donate their shares to the trust ?

So you would like them to right of £1.2 million 

 

Going on both Trusts previous performances and being run like closed cleeky bowling clubs is that a good idea

Edited by Norgethistle

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3 minutes ago, Norgethistle said:

So you would like them to right of £1.2 million 

 

Going on both Trusts previous performances and being run like closed cleeky bowling clubs is that a good idea

Works at all levels in German football 

why don’t you want shareholders to gift their shares ?

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All the other clubs mentioned had someone who put the cash in initially and then is getting paid back. Does this new group have such a person lined up? Will they tell us who it is?

It’s all soundbites and cliches. The manager is short of players and confidence.

That has nothing to do with the takeover - that’s down to the managers signings and his tactics etc.

Sorry - I’m with @Pinhead on this one. Sounds like a romantic notion and someone’s dream, but Save the Jags 2 would be just around the corner. 

Not for me.

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Just now, Big Col said:

All the other clubs mentioned had someone who put the cash in initially and then is getting paid back. Does this new group have such a person lined up? Will they tell us who it is?

It’s all soundbites and cliches. The manager is short of players and confidence.

That has nothing to do with the takeover - that’s down to the managers signings and his tactics etc.

Sorry - I’m with @Pinhead on this one. Sounds like a romantic notion and someone’s dream, but Save the Jags 2 would be just around the corner. 

Not for me.

Worked for Dunfermline 

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Just now, javeajag said:

Worked for Dunfermline 

 

1 minute ago, Big Col said:

All the other clubs mentioned had someone who put the cash in initially and then is getting paid back. Does this new group have such a person lined up? Will they tell us who it is?

It’s all soundbites and cliches. The manager is short of players and confidence.

That has nothing to do with the takeover - that’s down to the managers signings and his tactics etc.

Sorry - I’m with @Pinhead on this one. Sounds like a romantic notion and someone’s dream, but Save the Jags 2 would be just around the corner. 

Not for me.

Useful to remember how we got into save the jags 1.....

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2 minutes ago, javeajag said:

 

Useful to remember how we got into save the jags 1.....

Having to build 2 stands to suit SPL rules prior to them changing them was biggest impact

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Share most of the concerns around how this will happen, primarily the assumption that the 2 trusts can work together. They have shown no inclination to work as one in the past and in personal experince the Jags Trust is a clique and if you dont fit in with their way of doing things its very difficult to get things done.

i wish these guys well and have pledged to support them but its an extremely ambitious target and will be very difficult to achieve.

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8 minutes ago, javeajag said:

Works at all levels in German football 

why don’t you want shareholders to gift their shares ?

Would you gift £500k of your own money to the trust

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3 minutes ago, Norgethistle said:

Having to build 2 stands to suit SPL rules prior to them changing them was biggest impact

Not just that and it was managed by professionals and shareholders not fans 

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3 minutes ago, Norgethistle said:

Would you gift £500k of your own money to the trust

Who would be doing that much ?

and I have told them they can have my shares 

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14 minutes ago, Norgethistle said:

Would you gift £500k of your own money to the trust

The shares are only worth what someone is willing to pay. While the consortium bid is on the table, I can see why they might not want to give the shares away for free, however should that fail (due diligence/SPFL approval) then what would they be worth ?

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1 minute ago, javeajag said:

Maybe in total but as individuals and they can afford it 

The 9 off own 52% of the club, approximately £2.6 million worth or £300k each approx.

How do you know they can afford it, the spin was Beattie and Co had to sell due to finances, or is that spin changed now

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1 minute ago, Norgethistle said:

The 9 off own 52% of the club, approximately £2.6 million worth or £300k each approx.

How do you know they can afford it, the spin was Beattie and Co had to sell due to finances, or is that spin changed now

I think you need separate the clubs finances from the shareholders personal finances ...eg

 springford .... multi millionaire 

Beattie .... multi millionaire 

Allan .... multi millionaire 

those three on their own would prob get you close to 50%

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9 minutes ago, javeajag said:

I think you need separate the clubs finances from the shareholders personal finances ...eg

 springford .... multi millionaire 

Beattie .... multi millionaire 

Allan .... multi millionaire 

those three on their own would prob get you close to 50%

Jim Oliver owns more than them

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