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What if they shut down the season?


West Ender
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5 minutes ago, Emsca said:

This is just nonsense.

Why can they not distribute the cash without final league placements? Because thats what the rules say?

Well the Clubs make the rules - so change them .

This smacks of rules being appllied them bent / ignored to produce the outcome required.

Total  pish.

Seemingly with the last Rangers statement and confirmed in a email to them , the SPFL were in their  jurisdiction to hand out loans to Clubs in their hour of need in lieu of prize money.

From what I read it was Rod McKenzie the SPFL lawyer who verified this , which deems the question why weren’t the Clubs told this before they voted .

The plot thickens 

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1 hour ago, banderas said:

 

As far as this arguments goes has anyone seen the SPFL chairman's letter to the clubs from this afternoon .  the counter argument .

THE SPFL chairman Murdoch MacLennan

 

Dear All,

I am writing to you all to correct significant misinformation appearing in the media.

This misinformation is damaging to Scottish football as a whole – and to each and every member club of the SPFL.

Several suggestions have been made in recent days about the treatment of a resolution requisition by Rangers FC, about fee payments to clubs, and about the votes cast by Ladbrokes Championship clubs.

This letter is intended to set the record straight.

It has been suggested that the Board rushed to get a resolution out to members. In fact, the dates and times of a number of recent SPFL Board meetings were delayed specifically to ensure that one director had the time that he needed to be able to reach a decision.

The SPFL Board spent around an hour discussing in great detail the resolution requisitioned by Rangers. Only then did the Board, based on clear and unequivocal advice from a QC, determine that the resolution was not effective. The Rangers director on the Board confirmed that he was content with the time given over to that discussion.

He was also offered the opportunity of the SPFL’s legal counsel Rod McKenzie working with Rangers’ Company Secretary on a resolution that might be effective. To date, no further requisition has come forward from Rangers or from any other SPFL member.

It has been suggested that it is open to the SPFL Board to distribute end-of-season fee payments to clubs now, in the absence of league placings being finalised.
That is simply not the case.

For the Board to be able to authorise end-of-season fee payments to clubs (amounting to £9.3million gross), final league placings must be determined.
Those who have suggested that the SPFL may make such payments, without a line being drawn under Season 2019/20, are wrong. Further, it has been suggested that all Ladbrokes Championship club votes were cast on Friday night.

One Ladbrokes Championship club attempted to submit a voting slip, which did not reach the SPFL until late that evening. Earlier, at 6pm on Friday, that club had confirmed in writing to the SPFL that any attempted vote from that club should not be considered as cast.

We have had a number of conversations with the chairman of that club over the weekend, in which he reiterated that his club had not yet voted on the SPFL resolution. The SPFL has proceeded on the basis of the unequivocal instruction from that club received at 6pm on Friday.

At the time of writing, 40 of our 42 clubs have voted, with one Ladbrokes Championship club and one Ladbrokes League 1/League 2 club yet to cast a vote on the SPFL resolution. They have the remainder of the 28-day period to do so, should they wish.

The current level of support for the Board resolution is 85% of clubs in favour.

I have seen allegations made by the Rangers FC Interim Chairman Douglas Park, in a statement issued by Rangers at 3pm on Saturday, about the SPFL, its corporate governance, its culture, its office-bearers and its business operations.

I wrote to Mr Park on Saturday evening, requesting any material to support these allegations. I regret to inform you that, at the time of writing, I have received nothing from Mr Park. It is difficult to understand why Mr Park should not wish to share this alleged material with me.
I am entirely satisfied, based on all the information at my disposal, that the SPFL and its executives and legal advisers have acted wholly properly at every stage in this process.

Should any member club have evidence to the contrary they should bring it to me – indeed, I would argue they have a duty to do so – and I will deal with it in an entirely even-handed way.

To do otherwise is harmful to the standing, performance and effective operation of the SPFL and runs counter to the wider interests of our game.

Yours sincerely,

Murdoch MacLennan, Chairman

 

 

 

Why is this in the letter? It is totally irrelevant. What is relevant, however, is that the current level of support in the Championship is 70%.

 

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2 minutes ago, BowenBoys said:

 

Why is this in the letter? It is totally irrelevant. What is relevant, however, is that the current level of support in the Championship is 70%.

 

Total Spin , because they’re protesting so much , released 2 Statements within the last 24 hours they’re obviously ‘ concerned ‘

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Just how much money are we talking about. The Forfar chairman said they were due £3,700, are clubs really going under waiting in that little money. I do realise other clubs will be due much more. Going back to Forfar chairman, my take on his yes vote was because he wanted to keep Falkirk in league 1 and get Thistle also in this league as it could be worth £75,000-£100,000 for his team.

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19 minutes ago, Auld Jag said:

Just how much money are we talking about. The Forfar chairman said they were due £3,700, are clubs really going under waiting in that little money. I do realise other clubs will be due much more. Going back to Forfar chairman, my take on his yes vote was because he wanted to keep Falkirk in league 1 and get Thistle also in this league as it could be worth £75,000-£100,000 for his team.

No idea where he got that figure from , Forfar would get roughly 73k for finishing 9th in league 1 , heard his interview and he did say that .

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38 minutes ago, Emsca said:

This is just nonsense.

Why can they not distribute the cash without final league placements? Because thats what the rules say?

Well the Clubs make the rules - so change them .

This smacks of rules being appllied them bent / ignored to produce the outcome required.

Total  pish.

You need to understand the context.  

Spfl limited is a company with a deficit of assets against  Liabilities. 

if they distribute funds to clubs, and then the sponsors /tv companies reclaim sums, spfl could go bankrupt   I assume they have assurances from sponsors etc that if they call the leagues complete they can keep the cash  but if they don’t they may be into uncharted territory  you can’t really responsibly distribute money until you are sure that money is not going to be clawed back, especially when you don’t have your own cash to fall back on  

there’s a lot of uninformed bullshit going on  that’s being allowed to manifest itself because the spfl communications and transparency  has been hellish , not helped by some of its member clubs who the obfuscation suits   

remember directors have fiduciary duties and just because it’s football doesn’t mean that those don’t apply to spfl limited  

 

 

 

 

 


 

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15 minutes ago, jlsarmy said:

No idea where he got that figure from , Forfar would get roughly 73k for finishing 9th in league 1 , heard his interview and he did say that .

Is this not the final instalment of payments being paid out ? Not sure how the payments are shared out over the season. 

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15 minutes ago, jaf said:

You need to understand the context.  

Spfl limited is a company with a deficit of assets against  Liabilities. 

if they distribute funds to clubs, and then the sponsors /tv companies reclaim sums, spfl could go bankrupt   I assume they have assurances from sponsors etc that if they call the leagues complete they can keep the cash  but if they don’t they may be into uncharted territory  you can’t really responsibly distribute money until you are sure that money is not going to be clawed back, especially when you don’t have your own cash to fall back on  

there’s a lot of uninformed bullshit going on  that’s being allowed to manifest itself because the spfl communications and transparency  has been hellish , not helped by some of its member clubs who the obfuscation suits   

remember directors have fiduciary duties and just because it’s football doesn’t mean that those don’t apply to spfl limited  

 

 

 

 

 


 

Maybe I’m been simplistic about it but there should be money there

, total Income from tv deals UEFA is roughly 40 million , prize money to the Clubs is 25 million.

The spin was that all the income from the deals went to the Clubs which is probably not true as obviously the SPFL have running costs , salaries and tax implications to cover but IMO there is probably cash reserves there .

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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5 minutes ago, Auld Jag said:

I could be wrong but i don't think they are paid out in equal instalments.

 

5 minutes ago, Auld Jag said:

I could be wrong but i don't think they are paid out in equal instalments.

Not sure but would they have been paid out most of the money with 8 or 9 games to go 

If that was the case why would a lot of the Clubs be so desperate for such paltry sums of money 

What Doncaster was saying, was that prize money couldn’t be paid out until the fixtures were complete.

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It sounds if UEFA may be about to instruct member associations to abandon/end their seasons forthwith.  

Not clear what the terms will be but it seems it may cut across the SPFL's/Lawell's manoeuverings.  

It may also explain why he wanted decisions made by 5.00 p.m. on Friday. 

 

Edited by AirdrieJag
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3 hours ago, Third Lanark said:

Clyde of course - could not wait to vote for our expulsion 

fellow championship club Dunfermline and Dundee United have now voted against us : times with regards to a relegation or expulsion.  Both were twice in 2004 and again here.

ayr United, Queen of the south and Morton all voting against us

Clubs are not voting to expel us. They are voting to protect their own interests. As are we, and Rangers and Hearts. This isn't about good guys and bad guys. The side that clubs have fallen on is almost entirely dependent on their final league placing. Purely speculation, but I have no reason to think that Thistle wouldn't have voted yes if we'd finished 9th.

There lies (part of) the problem. Sporting fairness is not going to be protected in a situation where the participants are allowed to decide the outcomes. But the situation is very unique and that is what they are being asked to do.

The other part of the problem is at best absolutely shambolic administration by the SPFL,  and at worst something more sinister that none of us yet understand.

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4 hours ago, elevenone said:

Thanks. 

That makes sense

- all home games 

- away at East Fife and Falkirk, also ICT when back in the Championship

- Possibly add Dundee to the boycott. 

I had hoped for the best but I now feel that Dundee will change their vote to yes after their meeting yesterday with 4 members of the SPFL Board. 

I also think the talks on restructuring the leagues are bogus! They will take place for appearances sake but that's all. 

 

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17 minutes ago, jlsarmy said:

 

Not sure but would they have been paid out most of the money with 8 or 9 games to go 

If that was the case why would a lot of the Clubs be so desperate for such paltry sums of money 

What Doncaster was saying, was that prize money couldn’t be paid out until the fixtures were complete.

Sorry can't answer any of your questions. Also if this did get passed would all 42 clubs get money. If so how does that work, because the Premier wasn't being called as finished ?

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49 minutes ago, jaf said:

You need to understand the context.  

Spfl limited is a company with a deficit of assets against  Liabilities. 

 

jaf,  i wonder do you have the background knowledge to confirm  that the voting arrangements , i.e the if yes  for the  proposal , its confirmed and accepted and If no then it available for revision and the 28 days time period is lifted  from the standard  paragraph of Company Law and being used by the SPFL in their written arrangements.

personally i think  we need to be talking to DUNDEE big time , they may negotiating and it will not be up front payment funds, but how do they get an opportunity to mitigate their estimated 4 million deficit , which doesn't need to be monetary / cash  but may involve an opportunity to playoff, guaranteed insurance coverage, guarantors to funding  something along the lines that Charles Greene acquired for Sevco ltd (5w Agreement).

 

 

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2 hours ago, allyo said:

Clubs are not voting to expel us. They are voting to protect their own interests. As are we, and Rangers and Hearts. This isn't about good guys and bad guys. The side that clubs have fallen on is almost entirely dependent on their final league placing. Purely speculation, but I have no reason to think that Thistle wouldn't have voted yes if we'd finished 9th.

There lies (part of) the problem. Sporting fairness is not going to be protected in a situation where the participants are allowed to decide the outcomes. But the situation is very unique and that is what they are being asked to do.

The other part of the problem is at best absolutely shambolic administration by the SPFL,  and at worst something more sinister that none of us yet understand.

We get your point Allyo, you’ve made it countless times. The bottom line is we are 2 points behind QoS with a game and in hand and should not be relegated by a vote from teams that are above us and stand to gain from voting yes

Edited by jaggy
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I don’t see that Dundee’s hand is that strong.  The world and his wife knows that they were going to/actually did vote ‘no’.  If it suddenly transpires that they’ve voted ‘yes’ it would raise more suspicion. I suspect that initially the SPFL thought that they’d be able to talk someone round, but now it’s all come out they’ve pretty much thrown Dundee under the bus. I’ve always hated Dundee and have never been to Dens - happy to continue that however this turns out!

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15 minutes ago, Lenziejag said:

What do we think the SPFL would have done if it was a yes vote that hadn’t arrived with the votes standing at 7-2. 
 

Not sure that would be much of a problem for them. I suspect that they would just have said to the club "please send in your vote so that we could wrap this up" .... then gone round to Lawwel's for a champagne party. 

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9 hours ago, Emsca said:

This is just nonsense.

Why can they not distribute the cash without final league placements? Because thats what the rules say?

Well the Clubs make the rules - so change them .

This smacks of rules being appllied them bent / ignored to produce the outcome required.

Total  pish.

Murdoch Maclennan was a business partner of both Demond Desmond and Dennis O’brian two of Celtics biggest shareholders 

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