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What if they shut down the season?


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Just now, javeajag said:

On a serious note you can usually see the source of the information 

Yeah I appreciate that. Just being a bit flippant, but I do tend to think these graphs over simplify things and can be easily taken out of context, which is why I generally don't take too much notice. 

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2 minutes ago, allyo said:

Yeah I appreciate that. Just being a bit flippant, but I do tend to think these graphs over simplify things and can be easily taken out of context, which is why I generally don't take too much notice. 

Ok....I wouldn’t be so dismissive personally....it’s often good data 

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They will not get 11-1 from the top league and 75% of the rest isn't really realistic especially as the bottom division has already nailed its colours to 14 14 14.

 

Time to perhaps accept that demotion, regardless of any notion of fairness or unfairness, is possibly a better moral option than artificial survival. 

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21 minutes ago, allyo said:

It's okay for us but I just don't see how you can take 4 clubs and stick them all in with the teams that were previously in the leagues below them. After the season is over. And not even completed. 

It may have the democratic advantage of only burdening a few while suiting many. But surely if there is a threshold required within League 1 this could not carry.

Yep.  Really unfair on cove Peterhead and Clyde. Perhaps unfair on Forfar and  Edinburgh city. 
But the clubs on the reconstruction group will largely get what they want and I am sure none of them are acting out of self interest. 

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7 hours ago, BowenBoys said:

Matt Hancock is open to the idea of horse racing starting up again.  There is talk of it resuming within 10 days. It should be noted that the Health Secretary's constituency includes Newmarket.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2020/may/05/stalls-handlers-issue-safety-warning-over-horse-racing-return-to-action

The latest info I have that there is a meeting between Gov and the horse racing authority in a few days, but with the death rate rising every day,  it is going to be hard to get public support. The trainers have the horses ready to race and could go with just a few days notice. When it does start, it will probably be Lingfield and then Newcastle on the ATR and behind closed doors

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49 minutes ago, jaf said:

Yep.  Really unfair on cove Peterhead and Clyde. Perhaps unfair on Forfar and  Edinburgh city. 
But the clubs on the reconstruction group will largely get what they want and I am sure none of them are acting out of self interest. 

I agree it seems unfair to the  clubs mentioned in your post. Looking at the bigger picture  the restructuring from 4 to 3 Leagues is a plus point. It brings the SPL one step closer to the clubs currently in League 2 or at least those clubs with any ambition such as Cove. At the same time this proposal leaves Peterhead, Clyde, Forfar and Stranraer arguably no worse off than they are now - still in the 3rd tier. 

Phrases like "looking at thr bigger picture" are not normally associated with Scottish Football unlike words such as  "self-interest" Therefore as I said in an earlier post I now find it difficult to muster any belief that reconstruction will actually happen. We should prepare for next season in League 1.

 

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9 hours ago, jlsarmy said:

Yip , who do you sell cycle paths to ? ,  transport as it is just now is absolutely on its knees , do you really think in a recession that’s coming you’re actually going to get a government to invest in social housing.

We need to manufacture things etc etc and export to other countries  , we’re going to have to support start up businesses and put our faith in the entrepreneurs of our country to get back on our feet .

A government with forward looking ideas would invest in social infrastructure as well as supporting small and local businesses. Unlike the style of government we have got used to which has single mindedly supported multi-national non tax-paying conglomerates with billions of our taxes. The tories may promise to support entreneprurial efforts but most of their focus is on the companies which they and their friends have shares in. A different style of government may even support football as a socially useful recreational activity and invest in it!

Edited by scotty
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7 hours ago, exiledjag said:

I agree it seems unfair to the  clubs mentioned in your post. Looking at the bigger picture  the restructuring from 4 to 3 Leagues is a plus point. It brings the SPL one step closer to the clubs currently in League 2 or at least those clubs with any ambition such as Cove. At the same time this proposal leaves Peterhead, Clyde, Forfar and Stranraer arguably no worse off than they are now - still in the 3rd tier. 

Phrases like "looking at thr bigger picture" are not normally associated with Scottish Football unlike words such as  "self-interest" Therefore as I said in an earlier post I now find it difficult to muster any belief that reconstruction will actually happen. We should prepare for next season in League 1.

 


I am broadly in agreement  however I think the argument that Clyde Peterhead etc are no worse off because still in third tier is stretching it, because of the composition of that third tier and the travelling supports, hospitality sales, sponsorship, etc that will follow being in “the bottom division “ and  with that mix of clubs compared to the mix they might expect  

that said, I am not so pessimistic as you about the vote outcome  I think they have designed something here to save hearts and ourselves and then said to themselves how can we get the votes to get this through  when you look at each individual club in the bottom two divisions it ought to pass  when you look at the championship I think it ought to pass   That leaves the top division only and it’s unpredictable and probably relies on the or job Anne budge can do   That is what I am surprised she backed rangers resolution which isn’t the most diplomatic thing she has ever done  

 

 

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1 hour ago, scotty said:

A government with forward looking ideas would invest in social infrastructure as well as supporting small and local businesses. Unlike the style of government we have got used to which has single mindedly supported multi-national non tax-paying conglomerates with billions of our taxes. The tories may promise to support entreneprurial efforts but most of their focus is on the companies which they and their friends have shares in. A different style of government may even support football as a socially useful recreational activity and invest in it!

Don’t disagree with you , unfortunately that’s not the goverment we’ve got just now and whether you agree or disagree the SNP’s devolved powers muddy the waters even more .

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13 minutes ago, jlsarmy said:

Don’t disagree with you , unfortunately that’s not the goverment we’ve got just now and whether you agree or disagree the SNP’s devolved powers muddy the waters even more .

The SNP doesn't have devolved powers; the Scottish Government does, just like it did when it was mismanaged by the Labour Party.

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2 minutes ago, Jaggernaut said:

The SNP doesn't have devolved powers; the Scottish Government does, just like it did when it was mismanaged by the Labour Party.

I know but the Scottish Government are just now the SNP but as you say that could change 

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interesting tweet from ex SPL chief exec Roger Mitchell. The comments that follow the tweet also have an air of truth to them.  In essence the SPFL could have loaned or advanced payment oof prize monet but the other clubs would have to be confident the club recieving the loan could keep going. It looks like the other SPFL don't fancy Sevco's chances of surviving.

 

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31 minutes ago, laukat said:

interesting tweet from ex SPL chief exec Roger Mitchell. The comments that follow the tweet also have an air of truth to them.  In essence the SPFL could have loaned or advanced payment oof prize monet but the other clubs would have to be confident the club recieving the loan could keep going. It looks like the other SPFL don't fancy Sevco's chances of surviving.

 

Also interesting the apparent toxicity between the support of the two teams. Just from reading a few of the posts what I see is complete and total hatred  ……. But one team without the other could not exist  …… It follows then, if the Govan ugly sister goes bust, how long before the Bridgeton ugly sister would follow? I wonder if this virus might in the long run [but for all the wrong reasons] produce a positive impact on Glasgow?

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40 minutes ago, laukat said:

interesting tweet from ex SPL chief exec Roger Mitchell. The comments that follow the tweet also have an air of truth to them.  In essence the SPFL could have loaned or advanced payment oof prize monet but the other clubs would have to be confident the club recieving the loan could keep going. It looks like the other SPFL don't fancy Sevco's chances of surviving.

 


they do have some issues ...

 

image.jpeg

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13 minutes ago, javeajag said:

they do have some issues ...

Sorry for the selective quoting but you are absolutely right they do have serious problems and thats most clearly demonstrated by how much effort they are trying to keep their fans buying stuff. For example:

Monday 4th May, Good news the war with Mike Ashley is over Rangers now make millions off of new kit deal  https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/5558905/rangers-kit-castore-sports-direct/

Tuesday 5th May - reality dawns  https://www.ibroxnoise.co.uk/2020/05/sports-direct-rangers-shocker-this-cant.htm

I think this will all come to a head in the next couple of months. The deffered wages will be due in July and with no income on the horizon between now and then how do they pay that? Hummel are suing them for breach of contract and Sports Direct are due a settlement for the same issue, how do they pay those?  Douglas Park's other companies must be struggling with covid-19 so I can't see him bailing them out.

Celtic will be more than happy with a Sevco administration as it keeps them alive but very far behind. However administration doesn't end the Sport Direct saga or get them off paying Hummel.

Liquidation is the only thing that sets them free from the contracts that are killing them. However to go for another reincarnation hinges on who owns the stadium. If they can "keep the big house open" the hordes will still attend. Last time around the stadium belonged to the club and was part of the assets sold during liquidation. Rumours are that Dave King got security of the stadium as part of his loans to the club. If true Sevco part 2 would have to pay off Dave King before the could kick a ball.

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33 minutes ago, ARu-Strathbungo said:

Also interesting the apparent toxicity between the support of the two teams. Just from reading a few of the posts what I see is complete and total hatred  ……. But one team without the other could not exist  …… It follows then, if the Govan ugly sister goes bust, how long before the Bridgeton ugly sister would follow? I wonder if this virus might in the long run [but for all the wrong reasons] produce a positive impact on Glasgow?

If the Govan team goes bust again then I guess they will start "their journey back to the top" all over again. Their rivals would just look forward to 12+ in a row depending on how many leagues there are (assuming enough clubs survive) and ram it down the throats of their opposite number.  What is interesting though is the conspicuous absence of the Scottish media really examining the Govan teams finances, like real scrutiny. It's because the vast majority of the "journalists" don't want to go there. Too frightened of being blacklisted and not getting "exclusives". Time they grew a pair. It's not like it didn't happen in the past when "journalists" were telling everyone about "wealth off the radar" etc. Nor did they ever question once the Govan team chairman, a man described by a judge as a "glib and shameless liar". 

The media in this country still doffs it's cap to the "establishment" and IMO that applies to both football and politics.  Journos generally take a football/politics press release and publish it as fact. Another reason why printed media circulation goes down the drain unfortunately. The BBC are guilty too. Veracity just doesn't come into it anymore.

I remember Chick Young (aye, him) at Dens Park interviewing Di Stephano (remember that fraudster?) and the man who counted Saddam Hussein as one of his clients was telling the bold Chick that the SPL was one of the best leagues in the world and soon the likes of Beckham (at his peak) would we wanting to play here. Chick was now creaming himself and babbling "is that right, really, fantastic". Summed up the Scottish journo for me perfectly. I don't think it's changed that much although thankfully there are some different voices coming through, albeit on the margins.

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4 hours ago, jaf said:


I am broadly in agreement  however I think the argument that Clyde Peterhead etc are no worse off because still in third tier is stretching it, because of the composition of that third tier and the travelling supports, hospitality sales, sponsorship, etc that will follow being in “the bottom division “ and  with that mix of clubs compared to the mix they might expect  

that said, I am not so pessimistic as you about the vote outcome  I think they have designed something here to save hearts and ourselves and then said to themselves how can we get the votes to get this through  when you look at each individual club in the bottom two divisions it ought to pass  when you look at the championship I think it ought to pass   That leaves the top division only and it’s unpredictable and probably relies on the or job Anne budge can do   That is what I am surprised she backed rangers resolution which isn’t the most diplomatic thing she has ever done  

 

 

If we vote for this 14-14-16 then we are no better than all those who we vilified for voting in self-interest the last time.

Having said that, I would fully expect Thistle to vote in favour. We'd be mad not to.

The problem here, as I've said from the start, is a system which allows the participants to make up the rules. This will only ever be dominated by self-interest. There is no point in blaming the participants for looking after themselves. 

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