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What if they shut down the season?

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7 hours ago, e4b said:

The Rangers dossier is a surprisingly interesting read. Whilst it doesn’t live up to  Rangers’ bombast, and their motives  are dubious, it appears to me to be competently constructed, and shines further light into the shabby behaviour of the SPFL and clubs in this whole sorry mess. We should not forget that In the middle  of all this is the unnecessary  shafting pf our club.                                                      Our own CE has a couple of mentions, and the corroborated evidence of John Nelms’ behaviour  needs explanation - was he acting on the encouragement of SPFL members or employees, or is he an unstable maverick. Maybe both.  Also the apparent SPFL board view, hidden from clubs, that reconstruction talks are expected to be doomed to fail,  is disturbing. I would expect our board to make a careful response to this dossier before Tuesday, and to clarify our position re the reconstruction talks - what is our position and are there still credible prospects of a resolution in our favour.

I suspect over every close vote in the history of Scottish football  there will have been politicking , influencing, lying, emotional blackmail, etc.   Probably by both sides. People never remember the misdeeds of the losers. 
 

the rangers dossier reads like a one man campaign : Scott Gardiner  the what’sapp screengrab by the names of the other participants would seem to come from him  

whatever ends up happening as a result of this, rangers and Gardiner will have achieved one thing for sure - that no one will ever trust anyone else in Scottish football again, and definitely will not communicate by WhatsApp with one another  

 

 

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14 hours ago, BowenBoys said:

Apologies for selective quoting.

Watched the Rabb briefing today. Lost count of the number of times he said that they will be doing x or y in the coming weeks. Also casting doubt on the efficacy of measures that have been taken by countries who have successfully dealt with this virus. It is deeply frustrating. The reaction of this Government to this virus is shocking.

When Johnson won the election he thought he would spend four years jingoistically dog whistling to Little Englanders while his smug cohorts dismantled the country and lined their pockets. Now that they have to actually protect the citizens, their actions have been woefully inadequate. Criminally so, I would suggest. 

My guess is BoJo and chums are finding themselves in a situation that they neither expected or wanted. Today's government is neither competent or honest enough for the situation they find themselves.

When they make errors they should own them and try to repair the error in real time, they should also have the self confidence to be able to call out any situation that is known to be harmful …. but neither of these actions are part of the Conservative Party culture, which is:- you should never admit error, additionally you should cover up your error for as long as possible.

In fact the default generally within No10 Downing Street is, 'is this deniable'?

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@BowenBoys this thing is not over. Different countries have different experiences despite doing similar things.  Sweden v Italy for example. No one understands this virus.  Each government in learning all the time with advice from medical experts.  Each government is getting flak. Seems to be a combo of age, obesity, BAME(?), pre existing medical conditions, urban density, freedom of movement, indoor interaction with sufferers, genetics (just bad luck?).  It's f***ing nuts.

Edited by Lambies Lost Doo

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2 hours ago, Lambies Lost Doo said:

@BowenBoys this thing is not over. Different countries have different experiences despite doing similar things.  Sweden v Italy for example. No one understands this virus.  Each government in learning all the time with advice from medical experts.  Each government is getting flak. Seems to be a combo of age, obesity, BAME(?), pre existing medical conditions, urban density, freedom of movement, indoor interaction with sufferers, genetics (just bad luck?).  It's f***ing nuts.

It's far from over. The virus is indiscriminate. Governments and scientists are learning all the time.  Learning from what has happened before. In the case of the UK that means learning from WHO, China, South Korea, Taiwan, Italy. 

There can be no clearer indication of how our Govt. was prepared than Johnson boasting about going to a hospital and shaking hands with coronavirus patients. A reckless decision that nearly cost his life. To use one of their mantras, was that 'guided by the science'? And here's another much used message; 'right thing at the right time'. What about the failure to join EU procurement schemes? Was this the 'right thing at the right time'? It was driven by their ideology and hatred for the EU and put frontline NHS staff in great danger.

Late to lockdown. Moving patients out of hospitals and into care homes without testing. Counting envelopes sent out as tests completed. It's f***ing nuts.

 

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1 minute ago, BowenBoys said:

It's far from over. The virus is indiscriminate. Governments and scientists are learning all the time.  Learning from what has happened before. In the case of the UK that means learning from WHO, China, South Korea, Taiwan, Italy. 

There can be no clearer indication of how our Govt. was prepared than Johnson boasting about going to a hospital and shaking hands with coronavirus patients. A reckless decision that nearly cost his life. To use one of their mantras, was that 'guided by the science'? And here's another much used message; 'right thing at the right time'. What about the failure to join EU procurement schemes? Was this the 'right thing at the right time'? It was driven by their ideology and hatred for the EU and put frontline NHS staff in great danger.

Late to lockdown. Moving patients out of hospitals and into care homes without testing. Counting envelopes sent out as tests completed. It's f***ing nuts.

 

Totally agree BB, the UK has ballsed up the whole thing. The daily 5pm briefings are beginning to grate; lots of positive promises rather than acknowledging the truth. 

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2 minutes ago, sandy said:

Totally agree BB, the UK has ballsed up the whole thing. The daily 5pm briefings are beginning to grate; lots of positive promises rather than acknowledging the truth. 

Have just read this https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/may/07/ministers-unfulfilled-coronavirus-promises-eroding-uk-public-trust

 

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15 hours ago, Norgethistle said:

Internal air travel is still on going. External was stopped

Domestic flights or international?

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6 minutes ago, jagfox said:

Domestic flights or international?

Domestic continued.

Busiest airlines in Europe right now are DHL (cargo) and the Norwegian ones.

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13 minutes ago, jagfox said:

Domestic flights or international?

Domestic still on going. Never stopped just reduced due to less travellers

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I honestly don't think the government was caught off guard by the severity of the virus. Anyone who listened to the news from about late January knew it was pretty serious and likely to spread.

I just think they thought they had to let it go and do its thing and whatever will be will be. Then when it hit they were like, oh yeah this isn't nice. And it makes us look bad.

And by the time other countries started showing that there were actually positive measures that could do some good it was already too late.

Which strikes me as total incompetence.

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4 minutes ago, allyo said:

I honestly don't think the government was caught off guard by the severity of the virus. Anyone who listened to the news from about late January knew it was pretty serious and likely to spread.

I just think they thought they had to let it go and do its thing and whatever will be will be. Then when it hit they were like, oh yeah this isn't nice. And it makes us look bad.

And by the time other countries started showing that there were actually positive measures that could do some good it was already too late.

Which strikes me as total incompetence.

When you look at the times from 1st reported case to nationwide measures being put in place the UK was on a par with France, Italy & Germany, slightly longer than Spain, and way longer than Norway and Denmark. There is no real correlation on this either

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11 minutes ago, Norgethistle said:

When you look at the times from 1st reported case to nationwide measures being put in place the UK was on a par with France, Italy & Germany, slightly longer than Spain, and way longer than Norway and Denmark. There is no real correlation on this either

When you look at "pneumonia" deaths in UK in December, you can begin to conclude that the first reported case dates are nonsense.  It was 'a thing', way before we knew it was 'a thing' I think.

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15 minutes ago, Norgethistle said:

When you look at the times from 1st reported case to nationwide measures being put in place the UK was on a par with France, Italy & Germany, slightly longer than Spain, and way longer than Norway and Denmark. There is no real correlation on this either

But why wait for first reported case? Surely when people were dying in Italy and Spain they knew it was here.

Edited by allyo
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2 minutes ago, jaf said:

When you look at "pneumonia" deaths in UK in December, you can begin to conclude that the first reported case dates are nonsense.  It was 'a thing', way before we knew it was 'a thing' I think.

That appears to be the case throughout Europe, and if we had known it was COVID in December then other steps could have been taken.

China only admitted it had an issue in 31st December and even WHO only classified it as an Emergency in January, Pandemic status came in March.

I think there is growing evidence that it was present way longer and the fact China had it and knew prior to December, and to have the materials, resources and logistics ready to build two hospitals from the ground in 7 days merely 3 weeks later highlights that

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49 minutes ago, BowenBoys said:

It's far from over. The virus is indiscriminate. Governments and scientists are learning all the time.  Learning from what has happened before. In the case of the UK that means learning from WHO, China, South Korea, Taiwan, Italy. 

There can be no clearer indication of how our Govt. was prepared than Johnson boasting about going to a hospital and shaking hands with coronavirus patients. A reckless decision that nearly cost his life. To use one of their mantras, was that 'guided by the science'? And here's another much used message; 'right thing at the right time'. What about the failure to join EU procurement schemes? Was this the 'right thing at the right time'? It was driven by their ideology and hatred for the EU and put frontline NHS staff in great danger.

Late to lockdown. Moving patients out of hospitals and into care homes without testing. Counting envelopes sent out as tests completed. It's f***ing nuts.

 

I hear the official messaging is changing from "Stay Home.  Protect the NHS.  Save Lives" to "It's f***ing nuts". 

Sturgeon and Johnson have followed the same path but she's better behind a lectern than he is.  They listen to the same experts.  It's been consistent.

My wife is involved in testing for the NHS.   The general public VASTLY over estimate its importance.  It only works between 2 and 6 days of symptoms.  You could be virus free one day and then get it the next but think you are ok.  The admin is huge - they are trying to employ 1000's in NHS Scotland as part of testing strategy but there is not enough people to process and give results back in a timely manner.  They are even experiencing a lack of demand at Glasgow Airport testing centre from NHS staff as the majority of them are not directly impacted by Covid-19 care.  We have hundreds of empty beds and a lot of doctors and nurses doing a lot less work if they are not involved in Covid care.

The rush for ventilators has calmed down as the experts understand the virus better and ventilation is not the magic pill that was once thought.  The EU procurement plan has yielded very little.  Probably because everyone wants PPE and there is not enough out there this is part of the offshore, globalisation model that every western country had moved to..   Countries will  try to source their own and keep their own. 

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41 minutes ago, delurker said:

Domestic continued.

Busiest airlines in Europe right now are DHL (cargo) and the Norwegian ones.

Aer Lingus seem pretty busy too.

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9 minutes ago, allyo said:

But why wait for first reported case? Surely when people were dying in Italy and Spain they knew it was here.

Professor Jason Leitch said as it was constantly evolving they need to take into account other factors like people who need to work, have no garden, have mental health issues, abusive relationships, other health issues.  Just getting your head round a huge historical decision like that.  Imagine saying February we will lockdown the whole country.  All schools closed.  The whole of Europe, USA and beyond!  I've not left my postcode in 7 weeks.  Unimaginable before that.

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Just now, Lambies Lost Doo said:

Professor Jason Leitch said as it was constantly evolving they need to take into account other factors like people who need to work, have no garden, have mental health issues, abusive relationships, other health issues.  Just getting your head round a huge historical decision like that.  Imagine saying February we will lockdown the whole country.  All schools closed.  The whole of Europe, USA and beyond!  I've not left my postcode in 7 weeks.  Unimaginable before that.

To be honest I can understand that. Harsh to say but they probably needed a bit of horror to justify the lockdown and get the public on board.

By the way I left Barrhead for the first time in seven weeks on Monday. It was so exciting!

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10 minutes ago, Norgethistle said:

That appears to be the case throughout Europe, and if we had known it was COVID in December then other steps could have been taken.

China only admitted it had an issue in 31st December and even WHO only classified it as an Emergency in January, Pandemic status came in March.

I think there is growing evidence that it was present way longer and the fact China had it and knew prior to December, and to have the materials, resources and logistics ready to build two hospitals from the ground in 7 days merely 3 weeks later highlights that

I know two separate people who are "never have a day off in my life" types who were both floored with "a bad flu" after coming back from trips to The Rugby World Cup

 

 

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11 minutes ago, Lambies Lost Doo said:

 

My wife is involved in testing for the NHS.   The general public VASTLY over estimate its importance.  It only works between 2 and 6 days of symptoms.  You could be virus free one day and then get it the next but think you are ok.  

This is what I have been trying to find out for weeks.

So is it the case that you will only show up as positive once symptoms appear ? Are you infectious as soon as you contract it ?

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4 minutes ago, jaf said:

I know two separate people who are "never have a day off in my life" types who were both floored with "a bad flu" after coming back from trips to The Rugby World Cup

 

 

Same here, and with a lot of friends I have in Glasgow

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Positive update from austria

Austria was the first country to loosen their lockdown, all the way back on April 14.

New cases are steady and well below 100 every day.

The health minister has said - 'The situation is very constant, very stable.'

It is possible to avoid a second peak and escape lockdown.

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