Emsca Posted May 11, 2020 Report Share Posted May 11, 2020 4 hours ago, Jordanhill Jag said: Well after Three Years on a downward Spiral - My View is that we need New People running the Club - there will be enforced changes due to Economics No one apart from paid staff receives a remuneration - Board of Trustees - get external input - there are people external to the Club that would support us - means we avoid the politics - key to that is get a really Good Chair for Trustees - let him or her decide has to be someone like Lord Kelvin or someone of his stature - or Alan Foy CEO of SmartMetering PLC After that Trustee Board appoint the interim Board for Two Years with a Written remit and Plan The key issue is that this cant be done via a Committee or pals of pals - you want Good people - you approach them - give a time limit to there involvement - and a clear remit We need change - otherwise we will simply continue as we are - you cant get relegated to the level we have and not make radical change -it simply not sustainable I would be very happy to see a structure such as you have outlined, in place. I am just not sure where the impetus will come from to make it happen? The current incumbants are clearly not going to approach external advisors asking them to select and appoint a Board of Trustees who will then appoint their own Interim Board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Dastardly Posted May 11, 2020 Report Share Posted May 11, 2020 31 minutes ago, sandy said: Did I say anywhere I was happy to be gubbed? No. Did we get gubbed with Erskine & Doolan? Er no! The recent recipe of old carthorses and some younger loan players has failed us. Time to put our faith back into an exciting young team who actually want to be proud of wearing the badge. And where are all these young players who have managed to avoid all the scouts from other clubs ? (We do have Sena who came from Pollock) I’m not saying it wouldn’t be nice, but getting a winning team is far more important than how old they are and where they came from Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordanhill Jag Posted May 11, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2020 5 minutes ago, Emsca said: I would be very happy to see a structure such as you have outlined, in place. I am just not sure where the impetus will come from to make it happen? The current incumbants are clearly not going to approach external advisors asking them to select and appoint a Board of Trustees who will then appoint their own Interim Board. Your probs correct - but I was asked what my solution was - Ive given it - its based on the one Fergus used for Celtic - and gives a guarantee for a Fan Ownership Model thats sustainable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordanhill Jag Posted May 11, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 11, 2020 1 minute ago, Dick Dastardly said: And where are all these young players who have managed to avoid all the scouts from other clubs ? (We do have Sena who came from Pollock) I’m not saying it wouldn’t be nice, but getting a winning team is far more important than how old they are and where they came from Jackie Mac managed it ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandy Posted May 11, 2020 Report Share Posted May 11, 2020 3 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said: Jackie Mac managed it ? Yep JJ. It’s possible Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Dastardly Posted May 11, 2020 Report Share Posted May 11, 2020 Just now, Jordanhill Jag said: Jackie Mac managed it ? Would you really be happy for another year like the last 3 and say “never mind. At least we tried with youngsters.” All I am saying is that challenging at the sharp end is the priority. We need to get rid of this loosing mentality Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlsarmy Posted May 11, 2020 Report Share Posted May 11, 2020 3 minutes ago, Dick Dastardly said: Would you really be happy for another year like the last 3 and say “never mind. At least we tried with youngsters.” All I am saying is that challenging at the sharp end is the priority. We need to get rid of this loosing mentality We’ve got to make our relegation a catalyst for the future of our club , that has surely got to be the aim . If you look at teams like Hamilton , Motherwell and St Mirren they’re all bringing their own young players through and reaping the benefits financially when they make the first team and then they’re transferred on. IMO , we’ve got to engage more with the Schools to find talent as well , keep an eye on the lower leagues, there are plenty of players lost to the game after getting released by Rangers and Celtic There is absolutely no point given journeymen players 1 year contracts and then starting again year after year . We’ve done that for years with no real plan , create a reputation as a Club for giving players a chance and you’ll find it’ll be a lot easier to pick up new talent like Hamilton do . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlsarmy Posted May 11, 2020 Report Share Posted May 11, 2020 31 minutes ago, Dick Dastardly said: Would you really be happy for another year like the last 3 and say “never mind. At least we tried with youngsters.” All I am saying is that challenging at the sharp end is the priority. We need to get rid of this loosing mentality Nobody is saying it should be a team of 18 yr olds but it could be a team with young and experienced players , just now if you want to get rid of the losing mentality around the Club , we need to offload a lot of the players that got us relegated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Dastardly Posted May 12, 2020 Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 10 hours ago, jlsarmy said: Nobody is saying it should be a team of 18 yr olds but it could be a team with young and experienced players , just now if you want to get rid of the losing mentality around the Club , we need to offload a lot of the players that got us relegated. On that we can agree 100%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emsca Posted May 12, 2020 Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 11 hours ago, Jordanhill Jag said: Your probs correct - but I was asked what my solution was - Ive given it - its based on the one Fergus used for Celtic - and gives a guarantee for a Fan Ownership Model thats sustainable I'm not having ago at you , as I said if such a structure could be put in place I think it would have considerale merit. Its just that if it is very unlikely to happen, it is not really a solution - more just wishful thinking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARu-Strathbungo Posted May 12, 2020 Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 11 hours ago, jlsarmy said: Nobody is saying it should be a team of 18 yr olds but it could be a team with young and experienced players , just now if you want to get rid of the losing mentality around the Club , we need to offload a lot of the players that got us relegated. When people on the outside of the club look at what we have as an organisation they see a 'woke' club, with a youth structure in place and a woman's team established …. we are cute …. but we are a shyte football team. Is it not the time to now cut the cloth to suit our needs? We need a functioning and winning team on the park, that is the whole point of the clubs existence. Once we have that winning team, we become a community football club because the community will back a winning team. How many ST do we normally sell? about 2000? …. that is an insufficient number to run multiple football teams. If we are to have a youth structure, we want one that delivers talent to the first team manager, if it cant do that it just becomes a vanity project. The ladies football team is a nice idea, but one that you establish as an add-on to a successful football team. I like being part of a 'woke' club that will criticise racism, bigotry and homophobia, I like the thought that kids can play with a PTFC shirt and grow up being a small part of the Thistle footballing family, and it is good to see woman's football being played in Scotland. But [and it's a big but] firstly we need to have the club winning games, and being at the top end of the Championship, and eventually top six in the SPL then we can have the add-ons. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordanhill Jag Posted May 12, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 2 hours ago, Emsca said: I'm not having ago at you , as I said if such a structure could be put in place I think it would have considerale merit. Its just that if it is very unlikely to happen, it is not really a solution - more just wishful thinking. Ok your probably correct due to our current position - however - you have to start somewhere if your going to have change - so you start with what an alternative strategy to the one we have would look like There is obviously something not working or we wouldn't have gone from Top Six to level three within three Seasons Therefore its time for change Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Dastardly Posted May 12, 2020 Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 On 5/9/2020 at 7:35 PM, jlsarmy said: Agree with you , needs a strong board and a template for the future of the Club . For me , we’ve got to build an infrastructure and coach young players and give them a pathway to the first team , IMO paying wages to journeymen football players trying to get a last wage is the wrong way to go and whether that takes a couple of seasons so to get promotion so be it . Jackie Mac did it before with O'Donnell , Sinclair, Paton , Balatoni etc , players who were hungry to play first team football and make a career for themselves. There is no reason that can’t happen again . But why restrict us to that formula. There have been successful teams who have taken very different routes As Bear Bryant (American Football coach) said .... "Winning isn't everything, but it beats anything that comes in second." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlsarmy Posted May 12, 2020 Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 8 minutes ago, Dick Dastardly said: But why restrict us to that formula. There have been successful teams who have taken very different routes As Bear Bryant (American Football coach) said .... "Winning isn't everything, but it beats anything that comes in second." Don’t entirely disagree but we can’t just throw money at it , there has got to be a time when we start producing some of our own players. Look how much we wasted last year on Miller , Harkins , Cardle and McKinnon, with no results , there has surely got to be a different way . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allyo Posted May 12, 2020 Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 1 hour ago, ARu-Strathbungo said: When people on the outside of the club look at what we have as an organisation they see a 'woke' club, with a youth structure in place and a woman's team established …. we are cute …. but we are a shyte football team. Is it not the time to now cut the cloth to suit our needs? We need a functioning and winning team on the park, that is the whole point of the clubs existence. Once we have that winning team, we become a community football club because the community will back a winning team. How many ST do we normally sell? about 2000? …. that is an insufficient number to run multiple football teams. If we are to have a youth structure, we want one that delivers talent to the first team manager, if it cant do that it just becomes a vanity project. The ladies football team is a nice idea, but one that you establish as an add-on to a successful football team. I like being part of a 'woke' club that will criticise racism, bigotry and homophobia, I like the thought that kids can play with a PTFC shirt and grow up being a small part of the Thistle footballing family, and it is good to see woman's football being played in Scotland. But [and it's a big but] firstly we need to have the club winning games, and being at the top end of the Championship, and eventually top six in the SPL then we can have the add-ons. Or maybe we just go 100% women. We've been at this men's stuff for 140-odd years to little avail 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West of Scotland Posted May 12, 2020 Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 (edited) 21 hours ago, ARu-Strathbungo said: I like being part of a 'woke' club that will criticise racism, bigotry and homophobia, I like the thought that kids can play with a PTFC shirt and grow up being a small part of the Thistle footballing family, and it is good to see woman's football being played in Scotland. But [and it's a big but] firstly we need to have the club winning games, and being at the top end of the Championship, and eventually top six in the SPL then we can have the add-ons. You make it sound like it has to be one or the other. And it's not "woke" - it's simply not being shithouse. Edited May 13, 2020 by West of Scotland 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted May 12, 2020 Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 (edited) 5 hours ago, ARu-Strathbungo said: When people on the outside of the club look at what we have as an organisation they see a 'woke' club, with a youth structure in place and a woman's team established …. we are cute …. but we are a shyte football team. Is it not the time to now cut the cloth to suit our needs? We need a functioning and winning team on the park, that is the whole point of the clubs existence. Once we have that winning team, we become a community football club because the community will back a winning team. How many ST do we normally sell? about 2000? …. that is an insufficient number to run multiple football teams. If we are to have a youth structure, we want one that delivers talent to the first team manager, if it cant do that it just becomes a vanity project. The ladies football team is a nice idea, but one that you establish as an add-on to a successful football team. I like being part of a 'woke' club that will criticise racism, bigotry and homophobia, I like the thought that kids can play with a PTFC shirt and grow up being a small part of the Thistle footballing family, and it is good to see woman's football being played in Scotland. But [and it's a big but] firstly we need to have the club winning games, and being at the top end of the Championship, and eventually top six in the SPL then we can have the add-ons. The acadamy was set up and funded because Colin Weir wanted to help disadvantaged youth. The women's team was set up and funded seperately from the men's team so I don't think either should be blamed in any way for the demise of first team football over the past three years. You could argue that the first team shouldn't be holding back women's or youth football. Edited May 12, 2020 by scotty 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordanhill Jag Posted May 12, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 8 minutes ago, scotty said: The acadamy was set up and funded because Colin Weir wanted to help disadvantaged youth. The women's team was set up and funded seperately from the men's team so I don't think either should be blamed in any way for the demise of first team football over the past three years. You could argue that the first team shouldn't be holding back women's or youth football. I think its about Focus as a Club - as these things have been getting equal standing to the First Team on the Park Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emsca Posted May 12, 2020 Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 9 hours ago, Jordanhill Jag said: Ok your probably correct due to our current position - however - you have to start somewhere if your going to have change - so you start with what an alternative strategy to the one we have would look like There is obviously something not working or we wouldn't have gone from Top Six to level three within three Seasons Therefore its time for change Agreed . It s just how that is achieved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norgethistle Posted May 12, 2020 Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 (edited) Our focus till the season restarts needs to be getting the clubs shares and 100% of it’s assets into the fans hands whilst getting us through this time. There is no football to worry about, no votes, no potential reconstruction, to hide behind. We know we’re coming out this as a league 1 club (unless clubs fold), let’s make sure we’re alive and controlling our fate Edited May 12, 2020 by Norgethistle 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinhead Posted May 12, 2020 Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 12 hours ago, ARu-Strathbungo said: When people on the outside of the club look at what we have as an organisation they see a 'woke' club, with a youth structure in place and a woman's team established …. we are cute …. but we are a shyte football team. Is it not the time to now cut the cloth to suit our needs? We need a functioning and winning team on the park, that is the whole point of the clubs existence. Once we have that winning team, we become a community football club because the community will back a winning team. How many ST do we normally sell? about 2000? …. that is an insufficient number to run multiple football teams. If we are to have a youth structure, we want one that delivers talent to the first team manager, if it cant do that it just becomes a vanity project. The ladies football team is a nice idea, but one that you establish as an add-on to a successful football team. I like being part of a 'woke' club that will criticise racism, bigotry and homophobia, I like the thought that kids can play with a PTFC shirt and grow up being a small part of the Thistle footballing family, and it is good to see woman's football being played in Scotland. But [and it's a big but] firstly we need to have the club winning games, and being at the top end of the Championship, and eventually top six in the SPL then we can have the add-ons. Exactly we have lost who we are as a club with all this trying to be everything for everyone pish! Our bread and butter goes to the 1st team and everything else is secondary and nice to haves. Personally now i think we need to get shot of the woman's team and the youth academy if either are not self funding. Instead of being this cuddly inclusive club we need to grow teeth again! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabbath Posted May 12, 2020 Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 Ho Hum. 3 season tickets already bought for next year, beach balls and inflatable crocodile in the loft ready to go. With what I witnessed this year even if we had ten games in hand I wouldn't bet yer man Fred we would stay up. We are where we are because a pun o mince in a smart jersey would give us a game. As I always have said this is not the time for retribution and finger pointing, the time for that was when we appointed Archibald. Like the travel agent is heard to say Phuket.................Spoke to big Calum Graham today (Ashfield) he is interested in semi professional football that already puts him streets ahead of what we,ve got.............sign him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARu-Strathbungo Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 17 hours ago, scotty said: The acadamy was set up and funded because Colin Weir wanted to help disadvantaged youth. The women's team was set up and funded seperately from the men's team so I don't think either should be blamed in any way for the demise of first team football over the past three years. You could argue that the first team shouldn't be holding back women's or youth football. No blame intended. The football [mens] team is of most importance, all the rest are 'nice to haves'. I feel the PTFC organisation needs to prioritise its core requirements, and since there is little chance of football being played this year, perhaps they could use this time to redefine it's aims? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARu-Strathbungo Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 18 hours ago, West of Scotland said: You make it sound like it has to be one or the other. And it's not "woke" - it's simply not being shithouse. Sorry, don't understand where you are coming from. The point of my first mail is priorities ….. I think the first team playing and winning games, with some style, should be the first priority of PTFC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Dastardly Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 20 minutes ago, ARu-Strathbungo said: Sorry, don't understand where you are coming from. The point of my first mail is priorities ….. I think the first team playing and winning games, with some style, should be the first priority of PTFC. I don't think that style is important. Just playing and winning games. I think it is our Championship winning season was the last time we won more games than we lost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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