Jump to content

Sign in to follow this  
Jordanhill Jag

Why are we in this Position

Recommended Posts

Reading the recent Club Statement its as though our dismal record on the Park and the General Direction of the Club on Multi  Levels  over the last Few Years has nothing top do with our relegation  - We are not Victims - we are Bottom of the League - we hovered around relegation until the last day of the Season Last Year - Relegated from the Premier the Season Before - we are in the same Position this Year - therefore thats not the SPFL fault - thats Partick Thistles Fault - did anyone seriously think we were avoiding the drop this Season  if the League had played out ? 

 as a Wise Man Said -  "we are here to play Football - only problem is - we are Shite at it " 

So all the Victimhood Status - blaming the SPFL blah blah doesn't change the fact -we have dropped Two Leagues from Top Six a Four Seasons ago  ago under Three Different Managers

- so questions have to be asked - Why ?   Now there have been many changes at Board Level - but we keep failing - Why ? 

We were relegated by Ayr United to the Second Division 22 Years Ago today - in the Second Division we  had Brown McMaster -and it was post Save the Jags - lots of Goodwill - United Fanbase - everyone was 100% behind the Club - and trusted the Board who had stepped up during STJ  - a Home Crowd of 10,000  against Ayr certainly helped cushion the blow financially  starting the following Season     

Everything is about to change - Relegation and Covid 19 are a Perfect Storm  - and if the current Board dont make the harsh financial  decisions  that needs to be made - drops pretty much everything apart from 100% Focus on the First Team-   No More - Academy - Woman's Football - Thistle Trust - Social Causes  - PR Spin   - we will struggle - do we currently have a Board that turned us around - similar to Brown - Tom Hughes - Allan Cowan - Norman Springford  - Eddie Prentice - Jim Oliver - all very very experienced Businessmen - all of them  Jags Men -who understood the Club and its Fans   - we will see    

You start by taking responsibility for the position you are in - "we are here to play Football - only problem is - we are Shite at it " 

 

 

 

   

  • Like 1
  • Downvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

Reading the recent Club Statement its as though our dismal record on the Park and the General Direction of the Club on Multi  Levels  over the last Few Years has nothing top do with our relegation  - We are not Victims - we are Bottom of the League - we hovered around relegation until the last day of the Season Last Year - Relegated from the Premier the Season Before - we are in the same Position this Year - therefore thats not the SPFL fault - thats Partick Thistles Fault - did anyone seriously think we were avoiding the drop this Season  if the League had played out ? 

 as a Wise Man Said -  "we are here to play Football - only problem is - we are Shite at it " 

So all the Victimhood Status - blaming the SPFL blah blah doesn't change the fact -we have dropped Two Leagues from Top Six a Four Seasons ago  ago under Three Different Managers

- so questions have to be asked - Why ?   Now there have been many changes at Board Level - but we keep failing - Why ? 

We were relegated by Ayr United to the Second Division 22 Years Ago today - in the Second Division we  had Brown McMaster -and it was post Save the Jags - lots of Goodwill - United Fanbase - everyone was 100% behind the Club - and trusted the Board who had stepped up during STJ  - a Home Crowd of 10,000  against Ayr certainly helped cushion the blow financially  starting the following Season     

Everything is about to change - Relegation and Covid 19 are a Perfect Storm  - and if the current Board dont make the harsh financial  decisions  that needs to be made - drops pretty much everything apart from 100% Focus on the First Team-   No More - Academy - Woman's Football - Thistle Trust - Social Causes  - PR Spin   - we will struggle - do we currently have a Board that turned us around - similar to Brown - Tom Hughes - Allan Cowan - Norman Springford  - Eddie Prentice - Jim Oliver - all very very experienced Businessmen - all of them  Jags Men -who understood the Club and its Fans   - we will see    

You start by taking responsibility for the position you are in - "we are here to play Football - only problem is - we are Shite at it "

Sounds as though you are looking to place the blame and not take responsibility!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, scotty said:

Sounds as though you are looking to place the blame and not take responsibility!

The responsibility for our position is not the SPFL we are bottom of the league 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

The responsibility for our position is not the SPFL we are bottom of the league 

Correct.

So you can start your blame list with our current manager and work your way back from there.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Dark Passenger said:

Correct.

So you can start your blame list with our current manager and work your way back from there.

The blame always lies with the Manager - but the vast majority of Fans were delighted with his appiontment he was in a Promotion chasing spot with Ayr United - did he suddenly become a bad Manager overnight ?  

We were already in a downward spiral before him - so your right - our current position is with the current Manager - but thats been part of a long slow process - it didnt happen overnight 

However Im glad to see however that your in agreement that this a a PTFC problem - not an SPFL problem  

  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

Reading the recent Club Statement its as though our dismal record on the Park and the General Direction of the Club on Multi  Levels  over the last Few Years has nothing top do with our relegation  - We are not Victims - we are Bottom of the League - we hovered around relegation until the last day of the Season Last Year - Relegated from the Premier the Season Before - we are in the same Position this Year - therefore thats not the SPFL fault - thats Partick Thistles Fault - did anyone seriously think we were avoiding the drop this Season  if the League had played out ? 

 as a Wise Man Said -  "we are here to play Football - only problem is - we are Shite at it " 

So all the Victimhood Status - blaming the SPFL blah blah doesn't change the fact -we have dropped Two Leagues from Top Six a Four Seasons ago  ago under Three Different Managers

- so questions have to be asked - Why ?   Now there have been many changes at Board Level - but we keep failing - Why ? 

We were relegated by Ayr United to the Second Division 22 Years Ago today - in the Second Division we  had Brown McMaster -and it was post Save the Jags - lots of Goodwill - United Fanbase - everyone was 100% behind the Club - and trusted the Board who had stepped up during STJ  - a Home Crowd of 10,000  against Ayr certainly helped cushion the blow financially  starting the following Season     

Everything is about to change - Relegation and Covid 19 are a Perfect Storm  - and if the current Board dont make the harsh financial  decisions  that needs to be made - drops pretty much everything apart from 100% Focus on the First Team-   No More - Academy - Woman's Football - Thistle Trust - Social Causes  - PR Spin   - we will struggle - do we currently have a Board that turned us around - similar to Brown - Tom Hughes - Allan Cowan - Norman Springford  - Eddie Prentice - Jim Oliver - all very very experienced Businessmen - all of them  Jags Men -who understood the Club and its Fans   - we will see    

You start by taking responsibility for the position you are in - "we are here to play Football - only problem is - we are Shite at it " 

 

 

 

   

As you say we were in the relegation area for most of last season. But we didn't go down. Why? Because we played the full amount of games, so nobody can say if we would have got out of it or not. What we do know is, the SPFL had a vote and we got relegated, not because we were bottom after 36 games, but because we were in the wrong place at the wrong time. We did not get relegated on the pitch, we got relegated through a vote. A vote that most now concede at best could have been done better, at worst a complete farce.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

Reading the recent Club Statement its as though our dismal record on the Park and the General Direction of the Club on Multi  Levels  over the last Few Years has nothing top do with our relegation  - We are not Victims - we are Bottom of the League - we hovered around relegation until the last day of the Season Last Year - Relegated from the Premier the Season Before - we are in the same Position this Year - therefore thats not the SPFL fault - thats Partick Thistles Fault - did anyone seriously think we were avoiding the drop this Season  if the League had played out ? 

 as a Wise Man Said -  "we are here to play Football - only problem is - we are Shite at it " 

So all the Victimhood Status - blaming the SPFL blah blah doesn't change the fact -we have dropped Two Leagues from Top Six a Four Seasons ago  ago under Three Different Managers

- so questions have to be asked - Why ?   Now there have been many changes at Board Level - but we keep failing - Why ? 

We were relegated by Ayr United to the Second Division 22 Years Ago today - in the Second Division we  had Brown McMaster -and it was post Save the Jags - lots of Goodwill - United Fanbase - everyone was 100% behind the Club - and trusted the Board who had stepped up during STJ  - a Home Crowd of 10,000  against Ayr certainly helped cushion the blow financially  starting the following Season     

Everything is about to change - Relegation and Covid 19 are a Perfect Storm  - and if the current Board dont make the harsh financial  decisions  that needs to be made - drops pretty much everything apart from 100% Focus on the First Team-   No More - Academy - Woman's Football - Thistle Trust - Social Causes  - PR Spin   - we will struggle - do we currently have a Board that turned us around - similar to Brown - Tom Hughes - Allan Cowan - Norman Springford  - Eddie Prentice - Jim Oliver - all very very experienced Businessmen - all of them  Jags Men -who understood the Club and its Fans   - we will see    

You start by taking responsibility for the position you are in - "we are here to play Football - only problem is - we are Shite at it " 

 

 

 

   

Agenda 

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It is our fault we are bottom, but also good to have a scapegoat to blame as well.

I volunteer the referee for the QOS match who reversed a perfectly good penalty just as we were about to take it.

I hope he is at home hoping terrified that his incompetence is highlighted.

  • Thanks 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, erty13 said:

It is our fault we are bottom, but also good to have a scapegoat to blame as well.

I volunteer the referee for the QOS match who reversed a perfectly good penalty just as we were about to take it.

I hope he is at home hoping terrified that his incompetence is highlighted.

It's only Thistle. He will have forgotten about ages ago.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, allyo said:

Agenda 

Or Reality - if you have a Counter Argument feel free to make it ? 

I dont think playing the Victim is the Thistle way - we are bottom of the league - we have been Shite for Three Seasons - Three different Managers - two with previously very good Track Records / so lets hear your reason as to why we are in this position - or is it all the SPFL Fault - or a Big Boy did it and Ran Away ?  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, erty13 said:

It is our fault we are bottom, but also good to have a scapegoat to blame as well.

I volunteer the referee for the QOS match who reversed a perfectly good penalty just as we were about to take it.

I hope he is at home hoping terrified that his incompetence is highlighted.

Erty13 nothing against you, but this is selective revisionism.

If anyone considers the ref v QOS is fair game, then Stuart Bannigan is even fairer game for not converting the penalty that we were awarded in the first ten minutes against a weakened Dunfermline side the following week.

Face it - we are the authors of our own downfall for being bottom when the music stopped. There were several opportunities after New Year to have been clear of the bottom two. That we failed to do so lies squarely on our own shoulders and not on some perceived refereeing conspiracy.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
31 minutes ago, Auld Jag said:

As you say we were in the relegation area for most of last season. But we didn't go down. Why? Because we played the full amount of games, so nobody can say if we would have got out of it or not. What we do know is, the SPFL had a vote and we got relegated, not because we were bottom after 36 games, but because we were in the wrong place at the wrong time. We did not get relegated on the pitch, we got relegated through a vote. A vote that most now concede at best could have been done better, at worst a complete farce.

Thats fair enough -but we have not been out of the relegation zone for three seasons - so thats is hardly the fault the fault of the SPFL 

simple solution was not to be bottom ? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It is Thistles fault that we were bottom of the league, one point behind the second bottom but with a game in hand which we couldn't play because of a cup game. We hadn't got enough points to be off the bottom although with so many games to play we may well have pulled ourselves out of that position. It is the SPFL's fault that we didn't get that chance.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

Thats fair enough -but we have not been out of the relegation zone for three seasons - so thats is hardly the fault the fault of the SPFL 

simple solution was not to be bottom ? 

Simple solution is not to be bottom when the season ends, ie after 36 games. How often have we heard it is not over until it is mathematically impossible to be caught, or there is still plenty games to go. If we would have been relegated because we were bottom after 36 games or losing play off, fair enough. But not by a vote.What is it they say, football is not played on paper but on the pitch.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

Thats fair enough -but we have not been out of the relegation zone for three seasons - so thats is hardly the fault the fault of the SPFL 

simple solution was not to be bottom ? 

Another thing, the worst team in the SPFL are not being punished. Brechin whose chairman just happens to be on the SPFL board are not being put forward for the play off because the season has to be completed before that happens. Handy for Brechin eh.:thinking:

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

13 minutes ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

Or Reality - if you have a Counter Argument feel free to make it ? 

I dont think playing the Victim is the Thistle way - we are bottom of the league - we have been Shite for Three Seasons - Three different Managers - two with previously very good Track Records / so lets hear your reason as to why we are in this position - or is it all the SPFL Fault - or a Big Boy did it and Ran Away ?  

So what are you trying to say? You’ve just highlighted that two of the managers had good track records.  This would seem to suggest that even good managers can have bad spells. There is no guarantee of success. All the managers we have had in this time seem to have been backed financially by the board. it has undoubtedly been a terrible three years- but no one could have predicted the end to this season. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

Reading the recent Club Statement its as though our dismal record on the Park and the General Direction of the Club on Multi  Levels  over the last Few Years has nothing top do with our relegation  - We are not Victims - we are Bottom of the League - we hovered around relegation until the last day of the Season Last Year - Relegated from the Premier the Season Before - we are in the same Position this Year - therefore thats not the SPFL fault - thats Partick Thistles Fault - did anyone seriously think we were avoiding the drop this Season  if the League had played out ? 

 as a Wise Man Said -  "we are here to play Football - only problem is - we are Shite at it " 

So all the Victimhood Status - blaming the SPFL blah blah doesn't change the fact -we have dropped Two Leagues from Top Six a Four Seasons ago  ago under Three Different Managers

- so questions have to be asked - Why ?   Now there have been many changes at Board Level - but we keep failing - Why ? 

We were relegated by Ayr United to the Second Division 22 Years Ago today - in the Second Division we  had Brown McMaster -and it was post Save the Jags - lots of Goodwill - United Fanbase - everyone was 100% behind the Club - and trusted the Board who had stepped up during STJ  - a Home Crowd of 10,000  against Ayr certainly helped cushion the blow financially  starting the following Season     

Everything is about to change - Relegation and Covid 19 are a Perfect Storm  - and if the current Board dont make the harsh financial  decisions  that needs to be made - drops pretty much everything apart from 100% Focus on the First Team-   No More - Academy - Woman's Football - Thistle Trust - Social Causes  - PR Spin   - we will struggle - do we currently have a Board that turned us around - similar to Brown - Tom Hughes - Allan Cowan - Norman Springford  - Eddie Prentice - Jim Oliver - all very very experienced Businessmen - all of them  Jags Men -who understood the Club and its Fans   - we will see    

You start by taking responsibility for the position you are in - "we are here to play Football - only problem is - we are Shite at it " 

 

 

 

   

Whilst the way we ended up being relegated is wrong, it should not be used as a smoke screen to hide the shambles on and off the park for last 3 years.

We can play the victim all we want but that won’t pull us out the mess we are in. 

We had £600k in the bank a year ago, I hope to Hell the majority of its still there, as apart from funding a promotion push more importantly it’ll be needed for cash flow for last 2 months and next (hopefully only) 4 months.

Lessons need to be learned, and those accountable held. 

Currently we own less assets (ground) than a year ago, the ownership of the club is with a company who’s own owner and benefactor passed 6 months ago.  Whilst we have no debt, we have less assets and no cash flow or bank of last resort (Oliver, Reid, Weir, Allan etc).

I really fear for the future, and we need to concentrate on the core product first and foremost, the 1st team, spending anything towards other nice to haves that generate no short term positive return on investment must be shelved, as the next 2 years will be hand to mouth for us and many other clubs

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree with most of what @Jordanhill Jag says. We should have never been at the bottom when the league music stopped. 

It’s been a sad slide since we achieved top 6. But we have to build things up again from the third tier. It will be a long road back. I just hope the whole fan ownership ‘plan’ helps us rather than hinders us; we genuinely miss some of the Board members who has business acumen.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Norgethistle said:

Whilst the way we ended up being relegated is wrong, it should not be used as a smoke screen to hide the shambles on and off the park for last 3 years.

We can play the victim all we want but that won’t pull us out the mess we are in. 

We had £600k in the bank a year ago, I hope to Hell the majority of its still there, as apart from funding a promotion push more importantly it’ll be needed for cash flow for last 2 months and next (hopefully only) 4 months.

Lessons need to be learned, and those accountable held. 

Currently we own less assets (ground) than a year ago, the ownership of the club is with a company who’s own owner and benefactor passed 6 months ago.  Whilst we have no debt, we have less assets and no cash flow or bank of last resort (Oliver, Reid, Weir, Allan etc).

I really fear for the future, and we need to concentrate on the core product first and foremost, the 1st team, spending anything towards other nice to haves that generate no short term positive return on investment must be shelved, as the next 2 years will be hand to mouth for us and many other clubs

Agree with you , needs a strong board and a template for the future of the Club .

For me , we’ve got to build an infrastructure and coach young players and give them a pathway to the first team , IMO paying wages to journeymen football players trying to get a last wage is the wrong way to go and whether that takes a couple of seasons so to get promotion so be it .

Jackie Mac did it before with O'Donnell , Sinclair, Paton , Balatoni etc ,  players who were hungry to play first team football and make a career for themselves.

There is no reason that can’t happen again . 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Jordanhill Jag said:

Reading the recent Club Statement its as though our dismal record on the Park and the General Direction of the Club on Multi  Levels  over the last Few Years has nothing top do with our relegation  - We are not Victims - we are Bottom of the League - we hovered around relegation until the last day of the Season Last Year - Relegated from the Premier the Season Before - we are in the same Position this Year - therefore thats not the SPFL fault - thats Partick Thistles Fault - did anyone seriously think we were avoiding the drop this Season  if the League had played out ? 

 as a Wise Man Said -  "we are here to play Football - only problem is - we are Shite at it " 

So all the Victimhood Status - blaming the SPFL blah blah doesn't change the fact -we have dropped Two Leagues from Top Six a Four Seasons ago  ago under Three Different Managers

- so questions have to be asked - Why ?   Now there have been many changes at Board Level - but we keep failing - Why ? 

We were relegated by Ayr United to the Second Division 22 Years Ago today - in the Second Division we  had Brown McMaster -and it was post Save the Jags - lots of Goodwill - United Fanbase - everyone was 100% behind the Club - and trusted the Board who had stepped up during STJ  - a Home Crowd of 10,000  against Ayr certainly helped cushion the blow financially  starting the following Season     

Everything is about to change - Relegation and Covid 19 are a Perfect Storm  - and if the current Board dont make the harsh financial  decisions  that needs to be made - drops pretty much everything apart from 100% Focus on the First Team-   No More - Academy - Woman's Football - Thistle Trust - Social Causes  - PR Spin   - we will struggle - do we currently have a Board that turned us around - similar to Brown - Tom Hughes - Allan Cowan - Norman Springford  - Eddie Prentice - Jim Oliver - all very very experienced Businessmen - all of them  Jags Men -who understood the Club and its Fans   - we will see    

You start by taking responsibility for the position you are in - "we are here to play Football - only problem is - we are Shite at it " 

 

 

 

   

I think the point has been made on another thread that the reason we are talking about all this is because we were bottom of the league (at the wrong time). So yes we accept we are partly responsible for what is happening to our club. However the SPFL are also responsible in terms of the decisions made, actions taken and the manner in which they have been carried out. As far as I am aware Scotland is the only league in Europe to enforce relegation. The question must be asked, why? The answer I suspect is McLennan's enthusiasm to award his pal at Parkhead their 9th successive SPL Title. You can't have a champion and not have relegation! When he retires, soon I hope, I bet he will be gifted a lifetime season ticket at Parkhead! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, jlsarmy said:

Agree with you , needs a strong board and a template for the future of the Club .

For me , we’ve got to build an infrastructure and coach young players and give them a pathway to the first team , IMO paying wages to journeymen football players trying to get a last wage is the wrong way to go and whether that takes a couple of seasons so to get promotion so be it .

Jackie Mac did it before with O'Donnell , Sinclair, Paton , Balatoni etc ,  players who were hungry to play first team football and make a career for themselves.

There is no reason that can’t happen again . 

Bringing young hungry players to 1st team is different from funding an academy at this time

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Norgethistle said:

Bringing young hungry players to 1st team is different from funding an academy at this time

If you go with the Academy there has got to be an end product for it to be viable , you stick with it and have faith in your coaching staff to improve players to first team level.

Go Jackie Macs way you cherrypick players from other clubs who haven’t quite made it yet , same again need to trust Ian McCalls ability as a coach to improve them .

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
27 minutes ago, jlsarmy said:

Agree with you , needs a strong board and a template for the future of the Club .

For me , we’ve got to build an infrastructure and coach young players and give them a pathway to the first team , IMO paying wages to journeymen football players trying to get a last wage is the wrong way to go and whether that takes a couple of seasons so to get promotion so be it .

Jackie Mac did it before with O'Donnell , Sinclair, Paton , Balatoni etc ,  players who were hungry to play first team football and make a career for themselves.

There is no reason that can’t happen again . 

100 % agree that Jackie Mac took the right approach - but we need the Financial Infrastructure to support it 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, exiledjag said:

I think the point has been made on another thread that the reason we are talking about all this is because we were bottom of the league (at the wrong time). So yes we accept we are partly responsible for what is happening to our club. However the SPFL are also responsible in terms of the decisions made, actions taken and the manner in which they have been carried out. As far as I am aware Scotland is the only league in Europe to enforce relegation. The question must be asked, why? The answer I suspect is McLennan's enthusiasm to award his pal at Parkhead their 9th successive SPL Title. You can't have a champion and not have relegation! When he retires, soon I hope, I bet he will be gifted a lifetime season ticket at Parkhead! 

But we have been on a downward spiral for Three Seasons - that had zero to do with the SPFL - we are in this position of our own making   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×