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Court It Is Then


Bobbyhouston
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1 hour ago, East Kent Jag II said:

Scotty asked if the case starts all over again, behind closed doors.  Yes, with the three members of the Arbitration panel adjudicating.  My understanding is that the relegation / promotion question will be considered, and if rejected, the compensation question will be looked at.

More to the point, the first question they will look at is whether the resolution was valid.

The question of promotion/relegation is second order, never mind the alternative remedy of damages.

1 hour ago, East Kent Jag II said:

Lenziejag asked if the three promoted clubs should bother going to the expense of being represented.  In view of what's at stake particularly for Dundee Utd financially, their legal advice is that they should be there.  They could have left it to the SPFL, but probably run the risk of getting demoted, rather that promoted, knowing that lot!  Only joking!!!

Or very possibly they don’t want the SPFL reaching a settlement that they wouldn’t themselves be happy with if it came to it.

1 hour ago, East Kent Jag II said:

Does anyone know if Hearts get an automatic parachute  payment, or was that discretionary?  Not been mentioned at all.   It may be included in their £8 million, though.

The parachute payment is contractual and (IIRC) specifically protected by the SPFL Rules. I highly doubt it is part of the amount being litigated for.

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44 minutes ago, javeajag said:

Yes apparently true..

Huge breaking news out of Belgium. Title, relegation places voided by BAS right now. 

Currently, there are no champions in Belgium, no relegated teams. 

Did Mr Doncaster at the time not cite the Belgium example as the route Scotland should be following?  Wonder if he still thinks so.  

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1 hour ago, Garscube Road End said:

Erm! No! Best scenario is compensation in League 1.

Not so sure about that , there is money to actually give them , I think it’ll be resolved either by reconstruction or a null and void season ( no champions and no relegation)

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2 minutes ago, jlsarmy said:

Not so sure about that , there is money to actually give them , I think it’ll be resolved either by reconstruction or a null and void season ( no champions and no relegation)

Thistle and Hearts aren't even asking for null and void.

The season will not be null and void. That is not a remedy that any of the parties want.

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Just now, Woodstock Jag said:

Thistle and Hearts aren't even asking for null and void.

The season will not be null and void. That is not a remedy that any of the parties want.

It is though, because it is part of the action hence why Utd, Raith & Cove are involved.

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1 minute ago, Woodstock Jag said:

Thistle and Hearts aren't even asking for null and void.

The season will not be null and void. That is not a remedy that any of the parties want.

Can’t see that commonsense won’t prevail, no point in the compensation package when there is no money to give them unless it’s paid up over a period of time which I’m sure the Clubs won’t want .

Doesn’t leave much else on the table , if you take it that Lord Clark must have thought there was some sort of case there and we win that case , what other alternatives are there ?

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35 minutes ago, Pinhead said:

It is though, because it is part of the action hence why Utd, Raith & Cove are involved.

No it isn’t.

They are involved to oppose the reversing of their promotions by annulment of the resolution (in part).

Thistle and Hearts emphatically are not asking that the season be declared null and void.

Declaring the season null and void is something only a decision of the SPFL can do (probably needing an ordinary resolution).

Such a resolution is extremely unlikely because it would require:

(a) the Court to annul the whole resolution when that’s not what Hearts and Thistle are asking for; and

(b) the member clubs then to pass a resolution with 9-8-15 support which specifically denies Celtic, Dundee United, Raith Rovers and Cove Rangers the right to be crown champions.

Thats not very likely.

 

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1 minute ago, Woodstock Jag said:

No it isn’t.

They are involved to oppose the reversing of their promotions by annulment of the resolution (in part).

Thistle and Hearts emphatically are not asking that the season be declared null and void.

Declaring the season null and void is something only a decision of the SPFL can do (probably needing an ordinary resolution).

Such a resolution is extremely unlikely because it would require:

(a) the Court to annul the whole resolution when that’s not what Hearts and Thistle are asking for; and

(b) the member clubs then to pass a resolution with 9-8-15 support which specifically denies Celtic, Dundee United, Raith Rovers and Cove Rangers the right to be crown champions.

Thats not very likely.

 

How do you think it’ll be resolved if  ourselves and Hearts win the case ?

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30 minutes ago, jlsarmy said:

How do you think it’ll be resolved if  ourselves and Hearts win the case ?

With the caveat that I don’t think we will win the case:

(1) If arbitration annuls promotion/relegation then one of the following  three things happens:

(a) just that happens

(b) a new motion being proposed and passed for reconstruction to ensure Dundee United, Raith Rovers, Cove Rangers and, if necessary, others getting promotion

(c) a new motion is passed to relegate us anyway (if the reason we win is because the whole motion is annulled because Dundee vote stuff).

(2) Far more likely arbitration doesn’t undo promotion/relegation but awards Hearts and Thistle damages in which case one of two things happens:

(a) SPFL proposes a means of paying this through the advances on next year’s TV money, but Hearts and Thistle remain relegated; or

(b) The Clubs offer Hearts and Thistle reconstruction in return for them forgoing their compensation awards (if they are massive). And then vote for it.

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35 minutes ago, Woodstock Jag said:

With the caveat that I don’t think we will win the case:

(1) If arbitration annuls promotion/relegation then one of the following  three things happens:

(a) just that happens

(b) a new motion being proposed and passed for reconstruction to ensure Dundee United, Raith Rovers, Cove Rangers and, if necessary, others getting promotion

(c) a new motion is passed to relegate us anyway (if the reason we win is because the whole motion is annulled because Dundee vote stuff).

(2) Far more likely arbitration doesn’t undo promotion/relegation but awards Hearts and Thistle damages in which case one of two things happens:

(a) SPFL proposes a means of paying this through the advances on next year’s TV money, but Hearts and Thistle remain relegated; or

(b) The Clubs offer Hearts and Thistle reconstruction in return for them forgoing their compensation awards (if they are massive). And then vote for it.

2b would do me and does undo relegation.

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Not really wanting to give them any advice, but walking along the seaside from Kirkcaldy to Cove with a halfway stop in Dundee sounds quite pleasant. They could make good use of the Fife Coastal Path and have a photoshoot at Dalnottar Castle. Some nice bays and the odd golf course on the Angus coast in between. 

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11 hours ago, Woodstock Jag said:

Just because they want the same outcome doesn’t mean that their legal arguments about how you get there are necessarily the same.

How come they get another shot at it, though, when their case was rejected by the court ?

I understood from comments on this thread that all that can be argued at the arbitration is what was in the petition to the court ? Those 3 clubs petition was dismissed.

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from 4th official on twitter....sounds fun !

Tomorrow the board of directors of the competition in Belgium has a crisis meeting to discuss what happens next. 

There's still a game for promotion (so 2nd division wasn't completely stopped), while the first division did completely stop is seen as unfair and incoherent. 

We'll have to see if they're just going to add Waasland-Beveren, retake the vote and add some more explanation (like in France), or switch to 18 teams without the relegation. 

But according to the reading of the Waasland lawyer, Bruges seems to be champions. 

Further according to Beveren lawyer, promotion is under threat, as relegation is as well.

However, no one knows what the hell is going on right now as it is still unclear what part of the vote to end the league is still valid as of now. @BelgSportsFan 

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